Murder by Israel today

  Did, or does God approve of any of this?

Did Israeli soldiers murder unarmed civilians again?  Remember also they did the same thing in Lebanon.. Mar 20, 2009 04:30 AM 

‘The most moral army in the world’ killed civilians without cause’ JERUSALEM–Israeli soldiers killed unarmed Palestinian civilians without provocation or warning and vandalized their property during this country’s January offensive in Gaza, say some of the soldiers who fought there. In one incident, Israeli soldiers apparently herded a Palestinian family into a single room of their house and left them there, while the troops took positions upstairs and also set up a sniper’s post on the roof. Several days later, soldiers instructed the family to leave the house, directing them to depart the area by heading to the right. They neglected to inform the sharpshooter on the roof what they were doing. One mother and her two children mistakenly turned to the left and were promptly shot dead by the rooftop sniper. “He shot them straight away,” the squad leader said during the college discussion. “I don’t think he felt too bad about it, because, after all, as far as he was concerned, he did his job according to the orders he was given.” The same squad leader reported a general attitude of contempt for Palestinian civilians, a mindset that enabled Israeli soldiers to engage in callous or sometimes lethal behaviour. “I don’t know how to describe it,” he said. “The lives of Palestinians, let’s say, is something very, very less important than the lives of our soldiers.  “So, as far as they are concerned, they can justify it that way.”  In another incident, a company commander is said to have ordered his troops to shoot and kill an elderly woman walking past them at a distance of about 100 metres.  You do not get the impression from the officers that there is any logic to it – to write `Death to the Arabs’ on the walls, to take family pictures and spit on them, just because you can,” said a squad leader who opposed the order.  Oher soldiers described widespread abuses of property. “We would throw everything out the windows to make room and order,” said one soldier.  Everything in the house was tossed out the windows – refrigerators, plates, furniture. The order was to throw all of the house’s contents outside.” Human rights groups have harshly criticized the Israeli military for its conduct of the war in Gaza – including the use of white phosphorus, a chemical harmful to humans – but the reports published here yesterday were the first documented accounts by Israeli soldiers themselves about widespread abuses. According to the most recent Palestinian figures, 1,417 Gazans died during the three-week conflict, more than 920 of them civilians.  At least one Israeli organization, the International Institute for Counter-Terrorism, puts the civilian death toll much lower. The college course at which the soldiers related their experiences was taught by Danny Zamir, who said he was “shocked” by what he heard and decided to publish a transcript of the discussion in a newsletter for course graduates.  http://www.thestar.com/News/World/article/605363

  JERUSALEM (AP) — An increasingly disturbing picture of the Israeli army’s conduct in the Gaza war emerged Friday, as new witness accounts from Israeli troops described wanton vandalism to Palestinian homes, humiliation of civilians and loose rules of engagement that resulted in unnecessary civilian deaths. They also have echoed Palestinian allegations that Israel’s assault did not distinguish between civilians and combatants, at a time when some international human rights groups contend Israel violated the laws of war. Israel launched the offensive on Dec. 27 in what it said was an effort to end years of Palestinian rocket attacks from Gaza. The Palestinian Center for Human Rights, which conducted a survey of casualties, says a total of 1,417 people were killed, including 926 civilians during the 22-day offensive. “Shoot and don’t worry about the consequences,” was the message from the top commanders, he said. Speaking of a lieutenant colonel who briefed the troops, Mr. Marmor said, “His whole demeanor was extremely gung ho. This is very, very different from my usual experience. I have been doing reserve duty for 12 years, and it was always an issue how to avoid causing civilian injuries. He said in this operation we are not taking any chances. Morality aside, we have to do our job. We will cry about it later.  Israeli ethicists say they are troubled by what they have heard. “Unfortunately, I think that selective use of killing civilians has been very much on the agenda for fighting terror,” said Yaron Ezrahi, a political scientist at Hebrew University who has been lecturing at defense colleges. “The army believes that a weak spot of Israeli deterrence is its strong commitment not to kill civilians, and there has grown the sense that it might have to temporarily overcome that weakness in order to restore deterrence.”  ” http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5ioi_0jtO9RjMwPNRoXNCndRPRq3gD97204S80
   
a squad commander was quoted as saying: “What’s great about Gaza — you see a person on a path, he doesn’t have to be armed, you can simply shoot him. In our case it was an old woman on whom I did not see any weapon when I looked. The order was to take down the person, this woman, the minute you see her. There are always warnings, there is always the saying, ‘Maybe he’s a terrorist.’ What I felt was, there was a lot of thirst for blood.” http://www.iht.com/articles/2009/03/20/africa/21gaza.php
 
 One soldier asserted that extremist rabbis had told troops they were fighting a holy war.The soldier was quoted as saying that the rabbis had “brought in a lot of booklets and articles,” adding, “their message was very clear: We are the Jewish people, we came to this land by a miracle. God brought us back to this land, and now we need to fight to expel the non-Jews who are interfering with our conquest of this holy land.” http://www.nytimes.com/2009/03/21/world/middleeast/21gaza.html?ref=world
 
The ends do not justify the means.. and does the Canadian PM Stephen Harper and the Conservatives now also GIVE approval of all of this too? 
 
It is very clear that the Darby Plymouth Brethren, Dispensationalist  Christians to compensate for their failure to try to convert Jewish persons have come up with false reasons for not doing so as well
 
  
 
There actually is no Biblical basis, promises, prophecy for Israel reclaiming this land in the whole New Testament.. just more Old Testament Jewish spins.. http://mccainvrsobama.wordpress.com/2008/12/12/the-restoration-of/

 

          
…the Harper government has moved to align Canada with Israel and its staunchest supporters. Canada is now the most “Israel, right or wrong” government in the world, except for the Israeli government itself. Even Barack Obama’s new administration, itself obviously pro-Israel, has uttered a few mild criticisms about settlements in East Jerusalem and the banning of certain trade with Gaza. But not the Harper government. Mum’s been the word.But do Canadians, while of course being supportive of Israel’s existence and security, really want their country to be the most completely aligned with Israel, especially now that it is to be led by a very right-wing coalition that doesn’t believe in a two-state “solution” to the Palestinian problem?

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20090323.wcosimp24/BNStory/specialComment/home

 

Read   https://postedat.wordpress.com/2009/06/10/let-no-man-deceive-you/

  

There actually is no Biblical basis, promises, prophecy for Israel reclaiming this land in the whole New Testament.. just more Old Testament Jewish spins..   http://mccainvrsobama.wordpress.com/2008/12/12/the-restoration-of/

 The ends do not justify the means.. and does the Canadian PM Stephen Harper and the Conservatives now also GIVE approval of all of this too?  

 
SEE ALSO
 
 
– as to what it means to be chosen
 
– the dispensationalist reality
It is very clear that the Darby Plymouth Brethren Christians to compensate for their failure to try to convert Jewish persons have come up with false reasons for not doing so as well
 
  

So still now  what really is needed  firstly is not more CHEAP, PRETENTIOUS  self regulations,   the supposed discipline of their members , or even their ensuring their education, but real INSPECTIONS, EFFECTIVENESS , competency testing. 

 For it is a fact that anything that will put a self regulating body or a Ministry into a negative light will have a built in  tendency still to be denied,   suppressed, minimized in reality, to be ineffective .  

 
There in reality is the main  one important step that all consumers can take to protect themselves from any unscrupulous persons  and that is enforced, exemplary public exposure and prosecution of the supposedly guilty persons by a recognized judicial public body,  and so now how many such bad persons now have really been exposed, prosecuted in the last few years in reality too by the responsible Ministers as well?  None? and why not?   
 
Exemplary Public exposure and prosecution of the guilty serves very ones best interest… too often still missing in the PROFESSIONAL BODIES, EVEN IN THE RCMP, police   forces, churches, ALL GOVERNMENTS  as well it seems too.

  “about the ABUSERS, bullies, thugs, proud oppressors, war mongers “ 

THERE IS A  VERY BASIC COMMON MISCONCEPTION ON HOW TO DEAL WITH ANY PERCEIVED EVEN INJUSTICES, ABUSES, ANYWHERE, IN THE CHURCH AS WELL, BESIDES IMMEDIATELY CALLING THE LOCAL  POLICE..
 
THE NEW TESTAMENT IS CLEAR HOW TO DEAL WITH IT.. COMMUNICATION – AND YOU DON’T FIRST POST IT ALL ON THE NET.
 
First you merely ask the guilty, bad persons personally to repent twice, the first time without a witness, the second time with witnesses THAT you have asked them to repent.. and   proof, substantiation is NOT required.. after you have done that you can next post it openly on the net, tell all the others.
 
Next God is fully free to deal with the unrepentant guilty offenders and believe me he will.. I have now been doing for decades too..
 
I SIMPLY SEND AN EMAIL, I PUT IT INTO CLEARLY WRITING, SO THE GUILTY PARTY CANNOT SAY I DID NOT ASK HIM OR HER TO REPENT.
 
WHETHER THEY ACKNOWLEDGE IT OR NOT TO GOD DOES NOT MATTER.

THE POLICE, RCMP, MINISTERS, GOVERNMENT CONSULTANTS THESE DAYS, IMMIGRANT CONSULTANTS TOO  IT SEEMS , SEEM TO BE ANOTHER WORD FOR ABUSERS, THIEVES, LIARS CROOKS. SO WE ALL NEED TO DEAL WITH IT MORE EFFECTIVELY NOW TOO.

 

CANADA POLITICAL CARTOONS

PM STEPHEN HARPER’S PAID WINTER HOLIDAY

FOR THE SELECT FEW WHILE THE REST WORK TO PAY FOR IT.

More cartoons

https://postedat.wordpress.com/2009/12/14/not-so-funny-cartoons/ 

https://postedat.wordpress.com/2009/12/14/not-so-funny-cartoons-2/

https://postedat.wordpress.com/2009/11/02/canadian-poltical-cartoons/

http://thenonconformer.wordpress.com/2010/01/28/my-favorite-canadian-political-cartoons/

SEE ALSO http://picasaweb.google.com/anonconformer/Thenonconformer#  

 see also http://picasaweb.google.ca/anonconformer/  latest cartoons

http://thenonconformer.wordpress.com/2009/09/14/transport-canada-stealing-taxpayers-money/

 ONTARIO Facing pressure to release more details about alleged fraud or wrongdoing investigated by the auditor-general, the city revealed that it had fired three staff and suspended 10 others without pay. But the city would not say for which among a list of allegations in the report, including theft and improperly cancelled parking tickets, the employees were punished. Meanwhile, in a separate case of alleged fraud, the city announced it had fired nine staff it had sent home with pay last month for allegedly filing false health-benefit claims and pocketing the cash. However, the mayor and city officials would not say how much, saying it could jeopardize a police probe into the allegations, uncovered by the company that administers the city’s benefits, Manulife Financial. The report includes allegations that employees improperly cancelled parking tickets, worked $50,000 in “excessive overtime,” viewed pornography on city computers, wrongly recommended private contractors to homeowners and rented their own apartments to social-services recipients. Pressed by reporters, Mr. Miller said three of the employees facing allegations in the auditor-general’s report were terminated, one resigned, and another 10 were suspended without pay. Mr. Ford, like other members of the audit committee, received a confidential briefing on the punishments behind closed doors but was “severely warned” not to share what he learned. He accused the mayor of trying to keep a lid on the allegations and the city of being too soft on the accused employees: “It’s coming from the top.”

 WHEN THE TAXPAYER’S MONEY IS ABUSED BY THIEVES, ALCOHOLICS, IT IS THE PROGRAMS, SERVICES TO THE POOR AND NEEDY PERSONS THAT ARE GENERALLY FIRST MADE TO PAY FOR IT. WE NEED BETTER BUDGET CONTROLS AND BETTER PUNISHMENT OF THE BAD GUYS TOO.

 

9 city employees fired in benefits claim fraud Toronto Star –  BY THE NUMBERS The city’s fraud and waste hotline received tips leading to findings of wrongdoing in 42 cases. The auditor general highlighted 15 of the 42 cases in his report.

Toronto refuses to release details of alleged fraud Globe and Mail

a professing Christian Prime Minister of Canada

 

00sh

http://thenonconformer.wordpress.com/

 

 

Imagine that a professing evangelical Christian Prime Minister of Canada Stephen Harper is stooping so low that he is trying to buy votes with alcohol, beer.. Taxpayer’s money should never, ever be used to   buy any alcohol anywhere.. will he also give out free playboys, condoms next too?  

The Canadian Press   OTTAWA – A free “beef and beer” night at a popular hangout near Parliament Hill has drawn attention to a smorgasbord of receptions, drinks and hors d’oeuvres lobbyists serve up to MPs.  The cozy rounds of free alcohol and food have reached a scale where even some MPs say it’s time to establish a public registry for the events.  One lobbyist says associations representing a range of interests host three or four receptions in and around Parliament Hill every day the House of Commons is sitting.  An MP says lobbyists use the tactic to organize political support for favoured policies, acquisitions or decisions cabinet ministers are contemplating – without having to register the discussions under the Lobbying Act.  “In the spirit of transparency for lobbying, it would make sense that all activities would be reported,” says New Democrat MP Paul Dewar.  The beef-and-beer night took place the day the Harper government unveiled its recession budget on behalf of hard-pressed Canadians.  The affair became a gossip item not just for the size of the crowd, but the quality of refreshments.  Everyone who was invited and walked in the door received three complimentary beer tickets and a no-limit buffet of what participants later described as “really, really good” sirloin on a bun.  The hosts – the Association of Canadian Brewers and the Canadian Renewable Fuels Association – invited all 308 MPs.  Government guests spotted under the dim lighting included Treasury Board President Vic Toews, in charge of the federal purse strings, and Transport Minister John Baird. Baird said later that, as convivial as the night was, he did not have even a sip or a taste since he’s a vegetarian and does not drink beer.  Baird led the Conservative campaign for transparency and stiffer rules for lobbyists when he steered the Public Accountability Act through Parliament in 2006.  Ministers of state in the crowd included Alberta MP Rob Merrifield and Saskatchewan MP Lynne Yelich. Ontario Tory Dean Del Maestro, parliamentary secretary for Heritage Minister James Moore, was spotted, along with a handful of Conservative backbenchers as well as opposition MPs.  New Democrat MP Peter Stoffer was among those who turned out, although he says he stayed for only 10 minutes because he had to rush off for another event.  He said he sees nothing wrong with the receptions, lunches and meals the lobbyists host.   “If they gave me a Mercedes Benz, that I would see would be a problem,” he said, adding the events are useful to gather information.  Spokesmen for the two lobby groups that put on the night at the pub D’Arcy McGee’s emphasized the social aspect of the evening. But one of them acknowledged it was a lobbying event.  “It’s part of our overall outreach strategy with government, so yes,” said Andre Fortin, public affairs director for the brewers.  Fortin and a spokesman for the fuels group, Robin Speer, declined to disclose the cost of the event. They both said their associations do not reveal “budgetary” details.  Other recent receptions and dinners included events by the Dairy Farmers of Canada, which invited all MPs to a Chateau Laurier wine and cheese reception during an annual conference and select MPs to a dinner the following evening. Stoffer says teams of individual farmers visited MPs’ offices before the dinner to lobby on issues such as continued producer control over the supply of food. He jokingly called the teams “swat squads” – a method also used by other interest groups.  The Distillers Association of Canada has launched an annual whisky “tasting” for politicians.  Association president Jan Westcott says the tastings, which he says began at the suggestion of Commons Speaker Peter Milliken, are meant to inform MPs about the industry and acquaint them with Canadian spirits.  “Imagine you’re talking to some politician and you’re trying to get him to represent a point of view in, let’s say, fighting with a foreign government, because we are big exporters, to open up markets for us,” Westcott said.  “If he doesn’t think that product is very good himself, how effective is he going to be in carrying the case for us?”  Duff Conacher, of the government ethics monitoring group Democracy Watch, says recent guides issued by ethics commissioner Mary Dawson mean the complimentary food and drinks should be out of bounds for cabinet ministers and parliamentary secretaries if they are clearly an attempt at influence.  Lobbyists must register contacts with cabinet ministers, parliamentary secretaries, police aides and senior bureaucrats, but there is no requirement to register the lobbying of backbench MPs.  Liberal MP Roger Cuzner said he’s open to putting the receptions and informal lobbying on the record.  “I don’t think anybody would be offended by it or be intimidated by developing a registry,” he said.  http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/capress/090215/national/lobbyist_trough

http://thenonconformer.wordpress.com/2008/05/13/living-high-on-the-hog/

http://thenonconformer.wordpress.com/2009/02/14/clearly-an-unacceptable-abuse/

 

 (Gal 5:19 KJV)  Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 20   Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, 21   Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.  (Col 3:5 KJV)  Mortify therefore your members which are upon the earth; fornication, uncleanness, inordinate affection, evil concupiscence, and covetousness, which is idolatry: 6   For which things’ sake the wrath of God cometh on the children of disobedience:

about the bullies, thugs, proud oppressors, war mongers

The Hallmark of a democratic society is unregulated press and the right of free speech of all citizens, without being bullied , lied about, slandered but unfortunately tis is not always the case in Canada, not in the Internet, not even especially in the Christian Internet where your post can be twisted, lied about distorted, censored or yourself banned, likley by the same religious control freaks who would kill Jesus Christ today as well. They even try to tell us what to write.. How absurd. http://witnessed.wordpress.com/2012/04/11/now-about-the-abusers-bullies-thugs-proud-oppressors-war-mongers/

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Now we all do really have freedom of religion, freedom of choice, freedom of speech, the right to be heard now as well.. I clearly do believe in the right of everyone to speak, to speak out as well, and to be equally heard by all, so we can all judge what has been said if it is appropriate and we can next corresponding act upon it, even in the church, in the government, on the internet now too. Clearly some bad people falsely still DO DISALLOW THIS RIGHT… the realy bad persons especially as even I know this for sure as they falsely refuse the whole to be shared even as as to who they are firstly. They respond with a personal attack, inquisition, censorship, lies, slanders, diversions, distortions, instead of facing, dealing with the facts, truths being presented. Confirming to many what they still are really like, immoral, abusive bullies.  

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Some people say we need to turn our cheeks to our abusers and next they will become Christians because we love them is not true.. Jesus loved Judas and he Judas still went to hell.. if we continue with this approach we should le all the bad guys out of prison and they will be converted…. very very unlikely.

Yes they the unsaved will see we are Christians by how we Christians do love one another does not mean they will become Christians,, To become a Christian you need to repent and few people are willing to do this. Who wants to give up he pleasures of sin, a bad lifestyle on their own? not many.

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Let me tell you we do not have to accept human rights abuse that is a lie of the devil.. in this world we have the same rights as the bully even the right to see that a bully is punished for abusing us.. God is not ignorant about the injustices inflicted upon his people, nor does he accept any of our human rights abuses without punishing the abusers shortly.. see the Bible book of Esther if you have doubts..

Est 9:25 But when Esther came before the king, he commanded by letters that his wicked device, which he devised against the Jews, should return upon his own head, and that he and his sons should be hanged on the gallows.

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I have to admit it came to me as a shock firstly when I started to attend evangelical, Baptist, Pentecostal churches in Canada now as an adult that that same right to be respect, to speak, and to be heard, not to be bullied, falsely oppressed, the Legal and Human rights that I had before, often now did not exist in the churches surprisingly now of all places. Never saw so many control freaks, human rights abusers in my whole life next to the too often bad cops now too. And perversely many a despotic, crooked elder, pastor had wrongfully tried to shut me up, and even next had resorted next to slander me, to try to discredit me and what I had said, or whatever,

Even in the Christian circles we find many ostriches who cannot handle negative statements,

Jesus told us to preach solely the good news IS NOT TRUE, HE TOLD US TO PREACH THE FULL GOSPEL, THE GOOD AND BAD NEWS, THE BAD NEWS INCLUDES STILL THE REALITY MOST PEOPLE WILL GO TO HELL. THE PROPHETS OFTEN PREACHED MOSTLY THE BAD NEWS..One’s need to repent.

Many have it all wrong , yes we do not fellowship with thieves, liars, abusers, distorters, crooks, the bad persons whose real agenda is to take you to hell.. But that does not mean we kick out pout about the preachers who ask us to repent, whose simple, blunt messages many we find disturbing

Those who are ashamed of using the name of Jesus are not Jesus Disciples. It is only the name of Jesus that saves, heals, delivers you.. not any other name.. not the Jewish name…

In real life sibling rivalry, bullies, oppressors can be found everywhere, in our homes, amongst our associates, in our communities, on the net, in politics, civil and public services, even in the churches as well. These are the people who falsely abuse others and despise the human rights of others, and they falsely do think now that God himself approves of it or overlooks it all.. Nothing could be further from the truth. But our own final peace, reward will be in Heaven.  https://postedat.wordpress.com/2010/12/03/oppressors-or-bullies-are-always-unacceptable/

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Now about these false bullies, thugs, the proud oppressors, war mongers

This is what the Lord , the God of Israel, himself now rather says about them all:    “Many  sorrow awaits them; their false pride will soon lie in total ruins, they will be humiliated and  devastated rather. No one will ever brag about them again.  Listen rather to the forthcoming  cries,  their  cries of devastation due to their  great personal devastations, destructions.  They cry out in terror. Because they  have trusted in their own wealth and skill, they will be taken fully  captive unavoidably too.  Cursed are they also   because they had  refuse to do the Lord’s work, they held, hold back their swords from shedding Justice! “From their  earliest days, the proud oppressors, bullies  have lived in peace, never suffering setbacks but all that is now about to change. But the time is coming soon,” says the Lord,  “when I will send men to displace them  from their false self confidence, security. They will unsettle them, and permanently   then shatter their false peace, false confidence! At last they all  will be ashamed also of their false idol , their god of war.    You used to boast, ‘We are heroes, we are mighty men of war.’ But now the bully  and his supporters will all  be destroyed. His most promising youth are also now next doomed to slaughter,” says the King, whose name is the Lord of Heaven’s Armies.   “Destruction is coming fast for them; it’s calamity threatens ominously.  Rather  weep for him and cry!   See how the once strong scepter is rather broken, how the once supposedly beautiful staff is shattered!   “Come down from your glory and sit in the dust, you supporters of them too. They will also tear down all your false securities, refuge.. ‘The bully, oppressor,  lies in ruins, disgraced; weeping and wailing! Judgment has been poured out on them and their false supporters too.  “His strength has ended. His arm has been broken,” says the Lord. “Let him stagger and fall like a drunkard, cause he has rebelled against the Lord.  He rather will wallow in his own vomit,  ridiculed by all.  We had all heard of his once boastful , for his pride is very great.   We all seem to know of his lofty pride,   his arrogance, and his haughty heart. I also do know about his insolence,”   says the Lord, “but his boasts are empty—  as empty as his vain deeds. And the destroyer has stripped you bare!  Your past  Joy and gladness are gone.   No one now hears their once  shouts of joy. There is shouting, yes, but not of joy.   “Instead, their awful cries of terror can now be heard world wide too.  “I will put an end to them,” says the Lord, “for the people offer sacrifices at the pagan shrines and burn incense to their false gods.   but now all of  their wealth has disappeared.   There is crying and sorrow as a result. For I have smashed them now  like an old, unwanted jar.   How it is unrepairably shattered! Hear the wailing! Their  shame of Moab! It has become an object of ridicule, an example of ruin to all their  neighbors.”   This is what the Lord says:    “Look! The enemy swoops down like an eagle,   spreading his wings over them. Their resources cities will fall, and their strongholds will be seized. Even the mightiest of them will be in anguish like a woman in labor. For they have  falsely even boasted against the Lord. Now  “Terror and traps and snares will be your lot,” says the Lord. “Those who flee in terror will fall into a trap, and those who escape the trap will step into a snare.   I will see to it that you do not get away, for the time of your judgment has come,”   says the Lord. For a fire comes upon them to devour the entire lands, resources,  with all their rebellious friends, supporter “Now many , they weep for you!   Your sons and your daughters   have even been taken away as captives”.  Jeremiah 48

see also http://thenonconformer.wordpress.com/2008/12/26/young-offenders/

https://postedat.wordpress.com/2009/06/20/reality-a-lesson-for-all-of-the-rcmp/

God speaks to us in many ways today

Personal Humbleness is one of the basic prerequisite to allow God to personally speak to us. I know that many persons now tend to limit, cripple how God can speak to them, as only being through the Mind, through the Bible, only through others,  or through circumstances.. well I also know that the devil can speak to you and me that way now too.. or he devil can send you a supposedly wise person telling you what you should do , what to do. and  often rather making it a lot worse.

Although I had been a Christian for 15 years already. .I was 35 years old when someone said i could hear God speak to me and boy I  was mad.. mad  mad.. and I said it was all untrue..   I  recognized next that  the sprit of God was telling me not to get upset and that God would talk to me this evening, next I was to drive to my favorite spot where i loved to see the mountains views this evening a and which i did..  when i got there God told me to shut up and be quiet for 30 minutes first.. next he said for me to praise the lord.. which i did for 30 minutes.. and then i could hear God talking to me specially.. for about an hour.. he God next told me he had my life planned for me. Now from then on I have learned to talk with God, to pray to him, to share with him my needs, and to discuss them, as well as listen to what he says next..

Now I  had send a birthday present my nephew and I had left a part of it out.. God told me I could send it in another Parcel, so next I had  sent the other parcel next when I was subsequently told that the parcel was lost in delivery. This surprised me cause as why would God tell me to send it.. But a few weeks later I got a phone call telling me the parcel was found. it was still  delivered.. Jesus said my sheep hear my Voice, and the Bible says that you will not go to the left or right unless you hear a confirming voice telling you this is the way walk there in.

Some people seem amazed that God can, and will now speak to his children, given the proper conditions being met, but me I am often amazed how is it that so many people cannot hear God, as to what un-confessed, un-repented of sins are obstructing their relationship with him now..

Believe it I do often hear God, Jesus, holy Spirit talking to me in an audible and in audible voices. It brings me great joy always now too.

God will speak to us


-but we also do need to write it down because our memories tend to be very short.
-and we need to share it with others next as well for as we sow more will be given back to us..
If you know beforehand the Bible well you will also know the reality of his revelations which will not contradict the Bible..

God’s voice. Elijah described it as a still, small voice (I Kings 19:12).
I do always listen  for an inner audible voice, and I say too “Speak lord for they servant is ready to hear”..- Doubt may eventually next hinder you at first, but throw it off, reminding yourself that it is a biblical concept, and that God is present, speaking to His children.- Don’t take your own way,  yourself, or your own personal importance too seriously which is also a sin.. of pride, rebellion, stubbornness,
 
When you do, you become tense and get in the  way of the Holy Spirit’s movement. It is also  when  we cease our labors and enter His rest that  God is free to flow (Heb. 4:10). Therefore  turn your attention  toward God in praise and worship, seeking His  face. As you wait before God, fixing your gaze solely on Jesus,   in a humble state of mind  and become all still before him, fixing your gaze on Jesus,  God  is present with you, you will become more real to you and you too will discover that you are indeed  dialoguing with God.
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You Can Hear God’s Voice! ( and here is one of many approaches to do so)
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Four keys to consistent, powerful, life-giving conversations with God
 
How to receive revelation knowledge
 
An example of revelation knowledge is when you are reading the Bible and a verse leaps off the page, hits  you between the eyes, and God says, “This is for you right now.” These are precious experiences for the believer. However, for many, they do not happen often enough. There are seven things I do which allow me  the privilege of receiving revelation knowledge every time I read the Bible. Truth and insights leap off the  page and an understanding of how they are to adjust my life permeates my spirit and soul. I love this  experience and hunger for it every time I read the Scriptures. That is why I prepare myself by doing the  following seven things. Prayerfully reflect on these steps and determine which ones you do and don’t use. 
 
 
Biblical Meditation  Resulting in illumination, revelation knowledge, anointed reasoning  
Do Not Do This:
LEFTBRAIN
STUDY/RATIONAL HUMANISM
1. Have unconfessed sin
2. Have a pre-conceived attitude
3. Be independent: “I can…”
4. Read quickly
5. Rely on reason & analysis only 
6. Read without specific purpose
7. Take credit for insights
 
But Do This:
WHOLEBRAIN/HEART
MEDITATION/DIVINE REVELATION
1. Be washed by Jesus’ blood
2. Have a teachable attitude
3. Pray: “Lord, show me”
4. Slow down, ponder, muse
5. Combine anointed reason,  flowing pictures, music &  speech
6. Read with focused purpose
7. Glorify God for insights
 
The Seven Steps of  Biblical Meditation Explained: 

1. LORD, CLEANSE ME BY YOUR BLOOD: Since receiving divine revelation is at the heart of biblical meditation, you must prepare yourself to receive from the Holy Spirit by repenting and being cleansed by the blood of the Lamb. You must be obedient to previous revelations from God (Matt. 7:6), and confess any sin in your life, so you are not cut off from ongoing revelation (Is. 59:1,2; I Jn. 1:9).

2. LORD, GRANT ME A TEACHABLE ATTITUDE: Revelation is given to those who maintain an  attitude of humility, and it is withheld from the proud and the arrogant. So keep an  open, humble attitude before God, allowing Him the freedom to shed greater light on  any ideas you currently hold and to alter them as He sees fit (Jas. 4:6; II Pet. 1:19).

3. LORD, I WILL NOT USE MY FACULTIES MYSELF: You can do nothing of your own initiative but only what you hear and see by the Spirit (Jn. 5:19,20,30). You do not have a mind to use, but a mind to present to God so He can use it and fill it with anointed reason and divine vision (Prov. 3:5-7; Rom.  12:1,2). If you use your mind yourself, it is a dead work (Heb. 6:1,2).

4. LORD, I PRAY THAT THE EYES OF MY HEART MIGHT BE  ENLIGHTENED: Slow down as you read, mulling the text over and over in your heart and mind, praying constantly for God to give you a spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of Him (Eph.  1:17,18; Ps. 119:18).

5. LORD, I PRESENT THE ABILITIES TO REASON AND TO IMAGINE TO YOU TO FILL AND FLOW THROUGH BY YOUR SPIRIT: Meditation involves presenting your faculties to God for Him to fill and use. These include your left-brain reasoning capacities as well as your right-brain  visual capacities. Look for the river of God (i.e.  “Spirit flow”) to guide and fill both hemispheres, granting you anointed reasoning and dream and vision (Jn. 7:37-39). Music can assist you, as can muttering, speaking, and writing as you go through the discovery process (II Kings 3:15).

6. LORD, SHOW ME THE SOLUTION TO THE PROBLEM I AM FACING: Focused attention brings additional energies of  concentration of heart and mind, which help  release revelation. For example, note the difference between a ray of sunlight hitting a piece of  paper, and sunlight going through a magnifying  glass to hit a piece of paper. The focused energycreates a ray so concentrated that the paper bursts into flames. When you have a hunger to master a new understanding and discipline, that hungry and searching heart will cause you to see things you  would not normally see (Matt. 5:6).

7. THANK YOU, LORD, FOR WHAT YOU HAVE SHOWN ME: Realizing that the revelation came from the indwelling Holy Spirit, give all the glory to God for what has been revealed (Eph. 3:21). 

Another Great Aid to “Seeing”: Writing Out Scripture

When you write or type out a verse, you discover words which you  otherwise might have missed. Therefore, I write out verses which I  know are key truths for my life. I pray over them, diagram them,  analyze them, meditate on them. That is why I have written many of  my books. I write so I can learn, so I can put truths I am understanding in my own words and in a framework which is meaningful for me.

The following is the law which God gave for new kings who had just  been crowned and were coming to sit upon their throne for the first  time: “Now it shall come about when he sits on the throne of his  kingdom, he shall write for himself a copy of this law on a  scroll in the presence of the Levitical priests” (Deut. 17:18). Since we are kings and priests, are we to do any less (I Pet 2:9)? Let  us make the writing out of Scriptures an important part of our lives.

When we hear of one actually claiming to be able to hear the voice of God. However, we do  not scoff, for several reasons. First, men and  women throughout the Bible heard God’s  voice. Also, there are some highly effective  and reputable men and women of God alive  today who demonstrate that they hear God’s
voice. Finally, there is a deep hunger within us  all to commune with God, and hear Him speak  within our hearts.
As a born-again, Bible-believing Christian, I  struggled unsuccessfully for years to hear God’s  voice. I prayed, fasted, studied my Bible and  listened for a voice  within, all to no avail. There  was no inner voice that I could hear!   God set me aside for a year to study, read, and  experiment in the area of learning to hear His voice. During that time, the Lord taught me  four keys that opened the door to two-way  prayer. I have discovered that not only do they  work for me, but they have worked for many  thousands of believers who have been taught  to use them, bringing tremendous intimacy to  their Christian experience and transforming their very way of living. This will happen to you  also as you seek God, utilizing the following  four keys. The key are all found in Habakkuk 2: 1,2. I encourage you to read this passage before  going on.

Key #1 – God’s voice in our hearts may sound  like a flow of spontaneous thoughts. ( confused also by the devil’s obstructions sometimes) Therefore, when I tune to God solely (  In prayer I first do ask the devil to stop talking to me, and I ask God alone to speak to me, God next he answers this prayer, I tune to spontaneity. The Bible says that the Lord answered me and  said…(Hab. 2:2). Habakkuk knew the sound of can and does speak that way at times. How  ever, I have found that for most of us, most of  the time, God’s inner voice comes to us first  as an interrupted spontaneous thoughts, visions, feelings, or impressions, (since we tend top have no room for god and often are busy pursing our own selfish, self centered ways and thoughts) . For example, haven’t each of us had the experience of driving down the road  and having a thought come to us to pray for  a certain person? We generally acknowledge  this to be the voice of God calling us to pray for  that individual. My question to you is, “What  did God’s voice sound like as you drove in your  car? Was it an inner, audible voice, or was it a  spontaneous thought that lit upon your mind?”  Most of you would say that God’s voice came  to you as a spontaneous thought.So I thought to myself, “Maybe when I listen  for God’s voice, I should be listening for a flow  of spontaneous thoughts. Maybe spirit-level  communication is received as spontaneous  thoughts, impressions, feelings, and visions.”  Through experimentation and feedback from  thousands of others, I am now convinced that  this is so.

The Bible confirms this in many ways. The definition of paga, the Hebrew word for intercession, is “a chance encounter or an accidental  intersecting.” When God lays people on our  hearts for intercession, He does it through  paga, a chance-encounter thought, accidentally  intersecting our thought processes. Therefore, when I tune to God, I tune to chance-encounter thoughts or spontaneous thoughts. When I am poised quietly before God in prayer, I have found that the flow of spontaneous thoughts  that comes is quite definitely from God.

Key #2 – I must learn to still my own thoughts and emotions, so that I can sense God’s flow of thoughts and emotions within me.

Habakkuk said, “I will stand on my guard post and station myself on the rampart…” (Hab. 2:1). Habakkuk knew that in order to hear God’s quiet, inner, spontaneous thoughts, he had to first go to a quiet place and still his own thoughts and emotions. Psalm 46:10 encourages us to be still, and know that He is God. There is a deep inner knowing (spontaneous flow) in our spirits that each of us can experience when we quiet our flesh and our minds.I have found several simple ways to quiet myself  so that I can more readily pick up God’s spontaneous flow. Loving God through a quiet worship song is a most effective means for me (For God inhabits the praises of his people, his nearness is made more real,  note  II Kings 3:15). It is as I become still (thoughts,  will, and emotions) and am poised before God  that the divine flow is realized. Therefore, after  I worship quietly and then become still, I open  myself for that spontaneous flow. If thoughts  come to me of things I have forgotten to do,  I write them down and then dismiss them. If  thoughts of guilt or unworthiness come to my  mind, I repent thoroughly, receive the washing  of the blood of the Lamb, and put on His robe  of righteousness, seeing myself spotless before  the presence of God (Is. 61:10; Col. 1:22).

As I fix my gaze upon Jesus (Heb. 12:2), be coming quiet in His presence, and sharing with  Him what is on my heart, I find that two-way  dialogue begins to flow. Spontaneous thoughts  flow from the throne of God to me, and I find that I am actually conversing with the King of  Kings. It is very important that you become still and properly focused if you are going to receive  the pure word of God. If you are not still, you  will simply be receiving your own thoughts. If  you are not properly focused on Jesus, you will  receive an impure flow, because the intuitive  flow comes out of that upon which you have  fixed your eyes. Therefore, if you fix your eyes  upon Jesus, the intuitive flow comes from Jesus. If you fix your gaze upon some desire of  your heart, the intuitive flow comes out of that desire of your heart. To have a pure flow you  must first of all become still, and secondly, you  must carefully fix your eyes upon Jesus. Again I  will say, quietly worshiping the King, and then  receiving out of the stillness that follows quite easily accomplish this.

 
Key #3 – As I pray, I fix the eyes of my heart upon Jesus, seeing in the spirit the dreams and visions of Almighty God.

We have already alluded to this principle in  the previous paragraphs; however, we need to  develop it a bit further. Habakkuk said, “I will  keep watch to see,” and God said, “Record the  vision” (Hab. 2:1,2). It is very interesting that  Habakkuk was going to actually start looking  for vision as he prayed. He was going to open the eyes of his heart, and look into the spirit  world to see what God wanted to show him.  This is an intriguing idea.I had never thought of opening the eyes of  my heart and looking for vision. However, the  more I thought of it, the more I realized this  was exactly what God intends for me to do. He  gave me eyes in my heart. They are to be used  to see in the spirit world the vision and movement of Almighty God. I believe there is an  active spirit world functioning all around me. is world is full of angels, demons, the Holy Spirit, the omnipresent God, and His omnipresent Son, Jesus. There is no reason for me not to see it, other than my rational culture, which tells me not to believe it is even there and provides no instruction on how to become open to seeing this spirit world.

The  most obvious prerequisite to seeing is that  we need to look. Daniel was seeing a vision in  his mind and he said, “I was looking…I kept  looking… I kept  looking” (Dan. 7:2,9,13). Now  as I pray, I look for Jesus present with me, and  I watch Him as He speaks to me, doing and  saying the things that are on His heart. Many  Christians will find that if they will only look,  they will see. Jesus is Emmanuel, God with us  (Matt. 1:23). It is as simple as that. You will see  a spontaneous inner vision in a manner similar  to receiving spontaneous inner thoughts. You  can see Christ present with you in a comfortable setting, because Christ is present with  you in a comfortable setting. Actually, you  will probably discover that inner vision comes  so easily you will have a tendency to reject it,  thinking that it is just you. (Invalid Doubt is Satan’s  most effective weapon against the Church.)  However, if you will persist in recording these  visions, your doubt will soon be overcome by   faith as you recognize that the content of them  could only be birthed in Almighty God.God continually revealed Himself to His covenant people using dream and vision. He did so  from Genesis to Revelation and said that, since  the Holy Spirit was poured out in Acts 2, we  should expect to receive a continuing flow of  dreams and visions (Acts 2:1-4,17). Jesus, our  perfect Example, demonstrated this ability of  living out of ongoing contact with Almighty  God. He said that He did nothing on His own initiative, but only that which He saw the Father doing, and heard the Father saying (Jn.  5:19,20,30). What an incredible way to live!

Is it actually possible for us to live out of the  divine initiative as Jesus did? A major purpose  of Jesus’ death and resurrection was that the  veil be torn from top to bottom, giving us access into the immediate presence of God, and  we are commanded to draw near (Lk. 23:45;  Heb. 10: 19-22). Therefore, even though what I  am describing seems a bit unusual to a rational  twentieth-century culture, it is demonstrated  and described as being a central biblical teaching and experience. It is time to restore to the  Church all that belongs to the Church.

Because of their intensely rational nature and existence in an overly-rational culture, some will need more assistance and understanding of these truths before they can move into them. They will find this help in the book Communion With God by the same authors.

Key #4 – Journaling, the writing out of our prayers and God’s answers, provides a greater new freedom in hearing God’s voice.

God told Habakkuk to record the vision and  inscribe it on tablets…(Hab. 2:2). It had never  crossed my mind to write out my prayers and  God’s answers as Habakkuk did at God’s command. If you begin to search Scripture for this  idea, you will find hundreds of chapters demonstrating it (Psalms, many of the prophets, Revelation). Why then hadn’t I ever thought  of it? (Or why have I refused to do it is the question too)I called the process “journaling,” and I began  experimenting with it. I discovered it to be a  fabulous facilitator to clearly discerning God’s”

Many academic scholars study the Bible and they still fail at it drastically.
A Study (My use of one part of one hemisphere of my brain) 
1. Is nowhere endorsed in Scripture (II Tim. 2:15 is a mis-translation in the KJV Bible).
2. Is self in action (Humanism – a false god).

3. Is self using reason (Rationalism – a false god).

4. Results in wisdom from below – earthly, natural, demonic (Jas. 3:15). For example, reason caused Peter to be
at odds with the purposes of God (Jn. 18:10,11).

Study violates the following biblical principles:

1. Gal. 2:20 – I resurrect self, which no longer lives.

2. Rom. 12:1 – I am using my faculties rather than presenting them to God to use.

3. Is. 1:18 – I’m reasoning, rather than reasoning together with God.

4. Gen. 3:5 – I’ve fallen prey to the temptation of the Garden of Eden that “I can know good and evil.”

  

Meditation (Hebrew/Lamad) To murmur; to converse with oneself, and hence aloud; speak; talk; babbling;  communication; mutter; roar; mourn; a murmuring sound; i.e., a musical notation;  to study; to ponder; revolve in the mind; imagine; pray; prayer; reflection; devotion”  (Strong’s Exhaustive Concordance*)

Meditation (God’s use of every part of both hemispheres of my brain as He fills and flows out through my heart by His Spirit)

1. Is endorsed 18 times in the KJV Bible.

2. Is God in action within the individual.

3. Is God granting revelation through the heart and mind which has been yielded to Him.

4. Results in wisdom from above – pure, peaceable, gentle (Jas. 3:17).

Meditation applies the following biblical principles:

1. Gal. 2:20 – I let Christ live through me.

2. Rom. 12:1 – I am yielding my outer faculties to the indwelling Spirit (to “flow” – Jn. 7:38).

3. Is. 11:2 When reasoning together with God, I receive a spirit of wisdom and understanding and knowledge.

4. Jn. 5:19,20,30 – I’m living as Jesus did, out of divine initiative, doing what I see and hear my Father doing. “

– Visit www.cwgministries.org  for many more free articles, free downloadable books and additional information on hearing God’s voice.

So did you start your journey with God in full, or are you still lost, in the wilderness? still in un-confessed, un-repented  sins, self centered, selfishly doing your own thing. Trying wrongfully to do it in your own strength.

One of the most successful of Satan’s deceptions is the promulgation of the belief that he and his angels are not here on the earth, In Revelation 12:7-9 we read, “And there was war in heaven: Michael [Christ] and his angels fought against the dragon [Satan]; and the dragon fought and his angels, And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven. And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.” Satan’s angels are the angels that he deceived into following him in his rebellion against God. Notice that Satan and his angels [devils] were not cast out of heaven to hell; they were cast out to the earth, which is where they are right now! Jesus says in Luke 10:18, “I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven.” Revelation 12:12: “Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.” Additional texts which show that Satan resides on the earth are found in the book of Job. The story of the Garden of Eden is given in Genesis 2:8 through 3:24. There are only four persons mentioned: God, Adam, Eve, and the devil, Satan, who masqueraded as a serpent. Then, after Adam and Eve had been expelled, God stationed angels to guard the garden.  “Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created. . . .” God therefore certainly did not create the devil, but He did create the perfect, holy angel who later became the devil. When God created beings with free will, He knew that sooner or later one of them would begin to experience pride and selfish ambition just as Satan did. If Satan had not been created, the experience that happened to him would have happened to another angel. Why God created beings with free will, beings who can disobey if they choose, The devil still walks on earth and reports to God.  Job 1:7 says, “And the Lord said unto Satan, Whence comest thou? Then Satan answered the Lord, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.”  Genesis 1:31 tells us that “God saw everything that he had made, and, behold, it was very good.” Everything was in perfect harmony with everything else. None of God’s creatures ever hurt another or made another unhappy. Where, then, did these obnoxious things come from? Where do the diseases from which mankind suffers come from? Why do animals and human beings hurt and kill one another now when they did not do this originally? Why does the lion eat other animals now instead of straw like the ox, as it did before? Consider the experience of the apostle Paul. A dedicated soldier of truth for the Lord and writer of many of the books of the New Testament, Paul had a physical infirmity. In 2 Corinthians 12:7, he tells us where his infirmity came from. “And lest I should be exalted above measure through the abundance of the revelations, there was given to me a thorn in the flesh, the messenger of Satan to buffet me, lest I should be exalted above measure.” Paul says that his problem was from Satan. He also says that he was given the problem so that he would not become proud because of the abundance of God’s revelations to him. God revealed to Paul the whole truth concerning Satan’s rebellion, and it is easy to see that this privilege might have tended to make Paul proud. You see, God did not afflict Paul, but He allowed Satan to do so. Another text that shows that the devil is the cause of pain and suffering is Luke 13:11. “And, behold, there was a woman which had a spirit of infirmity eighteen years, and was bowed together, and could in no wise lift up herself.” Here a woman is described who was paralyzed in a bowed-together position, probably with arthritis, for eighteen years. Did God do this to that poor woman and make her suffer for eighteen years? Of course not. God is the ultimate of love and kindness. In Luke 13:16, Jesus explains who did do this to the woman. “And ought not this woman, being a daughter of Abraham, whom Satan hath bound, lo, these eighteen years, be loosed from this bond on the sabbath day?” You see, Satan afflicted this woman just as he afflicted Paul and just as he causes sickness and suffering in our world today. Satan is the one who causes all disease and suffering in our world.  The only hope we have of penetrating this wall of lies and deception which Satan has built around us is in the whole Bible,  the New Testament included, the standard for truth in our world. Remember that God cannot lie. (Titus 1:2). First Peter 5:8 tells us to “Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour.” We get a further understanding of the extent of our deception in 2 Corinthians 4:4, which explains that Satan “hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.” Proverbs 16:25 tells us that “There is a way that seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death.” First Corinthians 2:14 says, “The natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him.” In Matthew 24:24 Jesus Himself warns that “There shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.” 2 Corinthians 11:14,15. “And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.”

 

Latter Rain

Latter Rain (Christian Church) Movement – The real latter day saints..

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For a great background introduction see http://lifebyjesus.wordpress.com/2013/08/17/jesus-christ-is-god/

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 The Latter Rain Movement also now is  the Pentecostalism Biblical teaching that the Lord is pouring out His Spirit again, as He did at Pentecost, and equipping the Holy Spirit filled believers to do his will .
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The term “latter rain” was first used early in the history of Pentecostalism, when David Wesley Myland wrote a book called Latter Rain Songs in 1907. Three years later, Myland wrote The Latter Rain Covenant, a defense of Pentecostalism in general.
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 Joel 2:23, “Be glad then, ye children of Zion, and rejoice in the LORD your God: for He hath given you the former rain moderately, and He will cause to come down for you the rain, the former rain, and the latter rain in the first month.”
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Truthfully the  “rain” in this verse is the  outpouring of the Holy Spirit. The “latter rain” (the present  end-times outpouring) would be greater than the “former rain.”
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In 1948, a “revival” broke out in Saskatchewan, Canada, and the teachings of the Latter Rain movement were clarified. Those involved in the revival were convinced that they were on the verge of a new era, one in which the Holy Spirit would demonstrate His power in a greater way than the world had ever seen. Not even the age of the apostles, they said, had witnessed such a movement of the Holy Spirit.
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 Latter Rain doctrine includes the following beliefs:
– All the gifts of the Spirit, including tongues, are received through the laying on of hands
– All Christians can be demonized and do require deliverance
– God has restored all the offices of ministry to the Church, including apostle and prophet
– divine healing can be administered through the anointing with oil or the laying on of hands
– Our own praise and worship of God does  usher God more effectively   into our presence
– The women have a full and equal ministry role in the Church
– Eventually all denominational lines will be destroyed, and the Church will unify in the last days –
the “latter rain”   Church is  victorious over the world until the entrance of Christ’s kingdom
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Genesis 1:28,   ”Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth”
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THERE ARE GOOD AND BAD CHURCHES BUT THE NEW APOSTOLIC REFORMATION IS DECEPTIVE
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The International Coalition of Apostles headed by C. Peter Wagner is the most influential purveyor of the New Apostolic Reformation, a term coined by Wagner. This organization is really an extension of the New Order of the Latter Rain whose influences and mentors include William Branham, Franklin Hall, the Hawtin brothers, and more recently Bill Hamon, Paul Cain and the Kansas City Prophets. The doctrines of the Latter Rain have influenced most of the televangelists on TV today, and so have crept deceptively into many denominations. The main heretical teachings of the New Order Of The Latter Rain, as ruled in 1949 at the General Council of the Assemblies of God held in Seattle, were as follows: (1) The restoration of foundational apostles and prophets in the churches. (2) The teaching and promotion of a transferable impartation or anointing that are passed on “by” the laying on of hands “by” the will of man. (3) Confession and deliverance from sin to men. (4) The impartation of spiritual gifts by the laying on of hands such as the gift of languages for missionary service and other “ministry skills”. (5) The extreme and unscriptural practice of imparting or imposing personal leadings by the means of the gifts of utterance, “word of knowledge” or prophecy. (6) Distortions of scripture interpretations, which are in opposition to teachings and practices generally accepted among the Church. These doctrines deemed heretical by the Assemblies Of God in 1949, which are now common fare because of the Brownsville ‘Revival” and the Third Wave movement, are all being promoted today in the New Apostolic Reformation. http://www.scribd.com/doc/16611959/New-Apostolic-Reformation-Is-Deceptive
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I ATTENDED A LATTER RAIN CHURCH  FOR MANY YEARS, I LOVED THEIR TEACHINGS, THEIR GREAT SERVICES AT THE CALGARY CHRISTIAN CENTRE,  BUT  IN THE END I HELPED TO CLOSE THE CHURCH DOWN AND I HELPED TO GET  RID OF  ALL THE RATHER BAD PASTORS  INCLUDING REV DAVID LAGORE THERE TOO..  AS IT NOW HAD  TOO MANY CROOKS, DISHONEST PERSONS. THEY HAD FALSELY  HIJACKED LATTER RAIN TEACHINGS TO TRY TO  MAKE MONEY OUT OF IT.. THERE ARE ALWAYS STILL GOOD AND BAD PASTORS,CHURCHES TOO.. WHERE PEOPLE CAN GET FOOD POISONING  TOO.. http://anyonecare.wordpress.com/2008/07/12/bad-pastors-bad-deacons-bad-elders-bad-church/
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Here 28/30 pastor’s relatives were on the church payroll.. and lying, steal, adultery was also common even amongst the Pastors.. I CAUGHT ONE OF THEIR PASTORS RENTING WORLDLY  VIDEOS.
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EACH PERSON CAN BE A DR JEKYLL OR A MR HYDE CONCURRENTLY, A GOOD PERSON AT ONE TIME AND OTHER BAD PERSON NEXT TOO IT DEPENDS UPON WHAT PART OF YOU YOU NOW DO ALLOW TO DOMINATE, INFLUENCE, CONTROL YOU. WE CAN WALK IN THE FLESH OR IN THE HOLY SPIRIT. We can walk humbly or walk in a false pride… AND THE RESULTS WILL VARY TOO.
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By the way while I consider the Pentecostal churches to be far superior over any other groups, denominations  still there are good and bad Pentecostals, good and bad Pentecostal pastors, churches.  Just like there are good and bad Professing Christians  https://postedat.wordpress.com/2008/09/13/the-false-jesus-name-apostolic-holiness-church-oneness-pentecostal-christianity/
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It is a very sad reality that even these days in the churches  that up to 70 percent of the pastors have not been called by God, they are imposters, hirelings and are not genuine shepherds of the flock.  https://postedat.wordpress.com/2012/03/05/spirtual-abuse-by-the-so-called-christian-leaders/
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These third wave named Pentecostal Ministers are the crooks, thieves, liars who use the Church, Gospel to steal God’s money for themselves. they use a sensationalized approach of presenting the gospel. They do it cause it attracts visitors, followers and increases their incomes.
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1 Pet 5:2 KJV) Feed the flock of God which is among you, taking the oversight thereof, not by constraint, but willingly; not for filthy lucre, but of a ready mind;
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(1 Pet 5:3 KJV) Neither as being lords over God’s heritage, but being ensamples to the flock. The International Coalition of Apostles headed by C. Peter Wagner is a superficial, pretentious approach to the reality of real Apostleship and the related gifts of the Holy Spirit..

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If you let any of preachers alone tell you what is the Gospel truth and what you should believe you likely will end up going to hell, since all preachers are imperfect men, and all men tend to still lie as well and too often still for various reasons too.

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I serve Jesus and not mere man, and Jesus is always first for me. I thank God that while I as a sinner am still  totally helpless to be delivered from my sins here one earth, but Jesus died for them and forgave them when I admitted them, asked for his forgiveness. Should should we all, all pastors, included.
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The Latter Rain was a post-war movement within Pentecostal Christianity which remains for some PEOPLE STILL VERY controversial to this day. ( The problem often lies with the leaders, who did not live, practice, what they preach to others too. What is the Latter Rain teaching? Today a revival of the Latter Rain heresy that was rejected in 1950 by the  assembly of God denomination, It was wrong  that many of the Assembly Of God  Pentecostal churches were jealous, thus critical  of this Ministry to this day as well. Their rejection of it to me was unjustifiable still,and all of critiques firstly need  to be balanced by honesty..)) http://anyonecare.wordpress.com/2008/05/20/the-assembly-of-god-pentecostals-vs-the-latter-rain-pentecostals/
A very lively church when it is led by the right, Godly leaders.. and a very bad church when the shepherds are bad.. https://postedat.wordpress.com/2008/08/16/healing-todd-bentley-florda-lakeland-revival/
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Many people write half truths, these half truths still do not make liars into honest men..
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So far nothing has caused me to change my views on the subject.
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For clarification in discussion of the Latter Rain a distinction should be made between: *The Latter Rain Revival (1947-1952) *The Latter Rain Movement (1952-1960s) *Those persons next influenced by the Latter Rain.

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Origin and Influences

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The Latter Rain Movement had its beginnings in the years following World War II. It was contemporary with the evangelical awakening which was starting with Billy Graham at the forefront, as well as the Healing Revival with Oral Roberts, Jack Coe, and William Branham at the forefront. Although William Branham was never a part of the Latter Rain as such, he was revered by its leaders. It had in fact been a Branham meeting which triggered the start of the Latter Rain.
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Several Pentecostal leaders of a small orphanage outside of Saskatoon, Saskatchewan, after visiting the meeting got a vision for a different dimension of Christianity and began to fast and pray in search of it. Later that year, revival events occurred. News quickly swept across Canada and the United States, influencing many Pentecostal believers.  (This explains why it is found in Western Canada.. where it competes directly with the Christian & Missionary Alliance Corporation too. The Western Canada Alliance Churches sadly are  known for  preaching Pentecostalism   but not practicing, living it now too. See the many posts about the bad Alliance. 
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Because of its grassroots and unstructured nature, history may never know the breadth of its influence. As the revival itself died down after a few years, those who had been changed by the doctrine formed various groups which came to become known as “The Latter Rain (Movement)”. The following list includes some representative leaders of various branches, both past and present.

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Founding Leaders

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*George Warnock (who had been Ern Baxter’s secretary), wrote “The Feast of Tabernacles” which became very influential not only for its view of the feasts but for its approach to the Scriptures. One identifiable mark of those influenced by the Latter Rain is their spiritual hermeneutic. *George Hawtin and his brother Ern, were key in the early spread of the movement. They traveled widely, and as they traveled the spirit and influence of the Latter Rain caught on. *A. Earl Lee from southern California was one of the fathers of the movement in Southern California. He had previously been involved with Aimee Semple McPherson..
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Mainstream Leaders

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*Kevin Conner is a very influential Bible teacher who came out of the Latter Rain and who has taken the best of these new ideas and blended them with the more traditional hermeneutics. His approach has influenced such leading ministers as T.D. Jakes. Conner is in fact part of a larger movement known as MFI which represents perhaps the most theologically solid group to directly emerge from the Latter Rain. *David Schoch was a leader associated with this branch of the Latter Rain. The church he led is now known as “City At the Cross” in Long Beach, CA. They have a helpful article here [1] *Wade Taylor came out of the Latter Rain, and was mentor to Robin McMillan, pastor of the lead fellowship of Rick Joyner’s MorningStar Ministry, which itself is very reflective of a Latter Rain ideal. *Glenn Ewing and his son Robert Ewing from Waco, Texas. Among others, the Ewings trained Jim Laffoon, leading prophet for Every Nation.
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Cult-like Movements

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*John Robert Stevens and his movement “The Walk” are an example of a ministry which emerged from the Latter Rain but became cultish. Royal Cronquist was another well known leader in this group. Influential charismatic Francis Frangipane came out of Stevens’ ministry, leaving before it turned in a cult-like direction. *Sam Fife and his movement “The Move” are another example of a cultish movement which was associated with the Latter Rain *Bill Britton teaching about Jesus as a “sample” or “example” son is connected to the Manifested Sons of God Theology which was taken to theological extremes. *Maranatha Campus Ministries, an outreach to college and university campuses, was accused of being a cult because of its highly authoritarian structure. It dissolved in 1989, and many of its leaders regrouped later in the 1990s to form what is now Every Nation.
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Contemporary Figures

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*Bishop Bill Hamon from Santa Rosa Beach, Florida. Hamon has been very influential in the Charismatic movement, including being featured on the cover of Charisma Magazine. *Dr. Kelley Varner from South Africa has a teaching ministry which is Latter Rain based. *Charles Schmitt, pastor of the large Immannuel’s Church in Silver Spring, MD, was spent time in the Latter Rain.
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Schools

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*Elim Bible Institute in New York was the center of much Latter Rain activity. *Portland Bible College, where Conner formerly taught, is another example of a Latter Rain influenced school. *Pincrest Bible School in upstate New York. Founded by Wade Taylor and Bill Britton *Destiny Image Publications, while founded long after the Latter Rain, prints sympathetic titles by Joyner, Hamon, Taylor and others.
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As the list above demonstrates, the movement itself should be distinguished from those whom it ultimately influenced. Some branches of the movement ultimately led to cult like groups, some parts of the movement remained orthodox and also true to Latter Rain ideal, and other parts of the movement moderated the doctrine and ultimately had positive effects on the Charismatic and Pentecostal churches at large.

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Historically, some of the most ardent critics of the Latter Rain and its offshoot theology, the Manifest Sons of God have come from within the Pentecostalism. ( BUT THAT IS WHERE THE DEVIL WORKS MOST OFTEN TOO)

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With time however, the Charismatic and Pentecostal movements, while rejecting the more extreme elements of the theology, have been greatly influenced by other aspects such as the “fivefold” ministry and the laying on of hands.

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More recently, it has been those from Fundamentalist circles who have been the most severe critics of the Latter Rain, and have use various loose connections to the movement to paint everyone associated with a negative brush.

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When its proponents brought the new doctrine into the Pentecostal Churches and in particular the Assemblies of God it nearly split the church. Leaders of the Assemblies of God were concerned that it glorified men among other things and pointed to the “ye are gods” as evidence of severe theological error. They were also concerned that the movement espoused a post-millennial rather than premillennial scenario of the “End Times.” In 1949 the Assemblies of God condemned the doctrine of the ‘Latter Rain Movement’ as heresy.( So what!)

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The Latter Rain brought in a new focus on the spiritual elements of Christianity including personal prophecy and typological interpretation of Scripture. The term “Latter Rain” stems from Bible passages as Jeremiah 3:3 and 5:2, Joel 2:23, Hosea 6:3, Zechariah 10:1, and James 5:7. The idea of a “Latter Rain” was not new to the movement, but in fact was present from the earliest days of Pentecostalism, who believed at the time that return of speaking in tongues and the Baptism of the Holy Spirit marked the “Latter Rain” of God’s Spirit, near the end of history.

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Beliefs

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It is difficult to communicate the Latter Rain through reference to doctrine alone, because its most distinctive element is its spiritual atmosphere. Once one understands this basic point, it is easy to identify within the Pentecostal movement who has been impacted by the Latter Rain, and to what degree. Latter Rain proponents saw Pentecostalism as very dry in the post-war period, and in danger of slipping into a dry or mental formalism like many of their evangelical peers. When the Latter Rain hit the dryness was replaced with an almost hyper-spirituality, and the various doctrines lined up this basic idea.
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* The latter rain. The movement derives its name from its interpretation of Joel 2:23. The outpouring of the Holy Spirit on Pentecost had been the “former rain” that established the Church, but the current “move” of the Spirit was the “latter rain” that would bring the Church’s work to completion, and culminate in the Second Coming of Jesus Christ, which was imminent. Although this doctrine in itself had been around since Parham and the early Pentecostals, the Latter Rain broke with the dispensationalism which had become entrenched in Pentecostalism. Whereas dispensationalism is a pessimistic premillennialism, the Latter Rain emphasized victory. This led to various expressions of victorious minded premillennialism and ultimately postmillennialism. Rather than just try and save a few souls before rise of the anti-Christ, the Latter Rain emphasized the Church as overcoming and victorious. This shift alone is extremely significant and can be seen behind the Word of Faith movement, as well as most branches of the Charismatic movement.
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* Christian Unity. A major theme of the Latter Rain was unity among the believers, in the church service, in the geographic region, and at large. They taught that God saw the church organized not into denominational camps, but along geographical lines. They expected that in the coming last days, the various Christian denominations would dissolve, and the true church would coalesce into citywide churches under the leadership of the newly-restored apostles and prophets. This theme was recurrent among the Kansas City Prophets of the 1980s.
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* Laying on of hands. Unlike mainstream Pentecostalism, which holds that the baptism of the Holy Spirit usually comes after prolonged “tarrying” or waiting for the Spirit, the Latter Rain movement taught that the baptism of the Holy Spirit and the gifts of the Holy Spirit can be imparted on one believer by another through the laying on of hands. This impartation was not given to the body at large, but to specifically selected or qualified leaders.
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* The fivefold ministry. The Latter Rain taught that of the five ministerial roles mentioned in Ephesians 4:11 (apostle, prophet, evangelist, pastor, teacher), the foundational roles of apostle and prophet had been lost after the time of the first apostles, but God was restoring these ministries in the present day. This theme has continued to this day, and has been recently rebranded by C. Peter Wagner as the “New Apostolic Reformation”
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* The Manifest(ed) Sons of God. Some leaders of the Latter Rain movement taught that as the end of the age approached, a select group of “overcomers” would arise within the Church. These Manifest Sons of God would receive the “spiritual bodies” mentioned in 1 Corinthians 15. They would become immortal, and receive a number of divine gifts, including the ability to change their physical appearance, to speak any language, to teleport from place to place, and to perform divine healings and other miracles. They would complete the Great Commission, spreading the gospel throughout the world, and at last usher in the millennial reign of Christ.
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See also

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External links

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Books

*Pentecostal scholar Richard Riss wrote a master’s Thesis on the Latter Rain, which was repackaged as a book entitled “The Latter Rain” and is available from Honeycomb Visual Productions in Canada. This book is supportive of the movement. It is one of the few scholarly works available on the topic. *Reg Layzell, The Pastor’s Pen (Vancouver, British Columbia: Mission Publishing, 1965) *Dick Iverson. The Journey, A Lifetime of Prophetic Moments (Portland, OR: Bible Temple Publishing, 1995) *Stanley Frodsham “With Signs Following”
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PRAY HONESTLY ALWAYS  AND ASK GOD  FIRST TO TELL YOU THE TRUTH
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What the Bible says about Israel and the Church, one in history and prophecy

(Mat 23:37 KJV)  O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not! 38  Behold, your house is left unto you desolate. 39  For I say unto you, Ye shall not see me henceforth, till ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord.  24:1  And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple: and his disciples came to him for to show him the buildings of the temple. 2  And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down. 

Brothers and sisters, my heart’s desire and prayer to God for the Israelites is that they may be saved. For I can testify about them that they are zealous for God, but their zeal is not based on knowledge. (Romans 10:1-2)
  
“Beloved, while I was very diligent to write to you concerning our common salvation, I found it  necessary to write to you exhorting you to contend earnestly for the faith which was once for all  delivered to the saints. For certain men have crept in unnoticed, who long ago were marked out  for this condemnation, ungodly men, who turn the grace of our God into lewdness and deny the only Lord God and our Lord Jesus Christ.”
 
-Jude 1:3-4  “I marvel that you are turning away so soon from Him who called you in the grace of Christ, to  a different gospel, which is not another; but there are some who trouble you and want to pervert  the gospel of Christ. But even if we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel to you  than what we have preached to you, let him be accursed. As we have said before, so now I say  again, if anyone preaches any other gospel to you than what you have received, let him be  accursed. For do I now persuade men, or God? Or do I seek to please men? For if I still pleased  men, I would not be a bondservant of Christ.” -Gal 1:6-10
 
And do you have one, one New Testament verse that confirms Israel’s present return and possession of the Promised land. I am not aware of one, If you do which one is it?  It is unbelievable, undeniable  that the professing Christian people who do not know the Bible can be so easily deceived, led astray too by many others, bad pastors and Jewish persons, Zionists included..  We can all easily know that the Jews had revolted. despised God  and helped to kill their own Messiah Jesus Christ now as well, so their temple was destroyed and they were scattered world wide. Deuteronomy 28:64 “Then the Lord will scatter you among all nations, from one end of the earth to the other. There you will worship other gods–gods of wood and stone, which neither you nor your fathers have known.” and no return was promsed the third time and why?  http://mccainvrsobama.wordpress.com/2010/09/23/even-as-to-the-promised-land/
 
Too many fundamentals, professing Christians now falsely do ste that the establishment of the State of Israel in 1948 was prophesied in Scripture while there is no direct support of this in the New Testament Bible even still. Zionism, on the other hand, “is a secularist, largely atheistic ideology” that emerged in the late 19th century. God still does not require the human input to fulfill his own prophecies. Now too many Christian Zionists, extremists do falsely do now believe that in order to fulfill all of the Biblical prophecy, Israel must next conquer most of the Middle East. And anyone watched the mostly self centered, get richer TV evangelists such as a Pat Robertson or John Hagee and their distorted sermons scenarios involving the future “Rapture,” Jesus Christ and also Israel, should also quickly firstly now realize that these false prophets are not only fleecing, scaring their flock to give more money but falsely are into worshipping the false idol of Israel. .John Hagee pays himself over a million dollars a year in TAX FREE money while having several palaces to live in, like the $2.1 million 7,969-acre ranch outside Brackettville, Texas , with five lodges, including a “main lodge” and a gun locker.;Once considered a small marginal doctrine among evangelicals, the false dispensationalist theology of Christian Zionism has greatly escalated, ironically falsely with the help of jess, Messianic Jews, Judaizers and many others too. The reality still is that the parable of the vineyard (Matt 21:33-43) clearly shows that the Christian Church totally now rather succumbs all of the past promises made to Israel. Be careful about accepting anyone’s word about Christian Zionism do first read the Bible, New Testament for yourself and know the truth rather. http://witnessed.wordpress.com/2008/07/29/the-2-promised-returns/
 
Let them firstly look at their own scriptures..
   
Be strong and courageous, because you will lead these people to inherit the land I swore to their forefathers to give them. (Joshua 1,6)
 
 
(Deu 4:23 KJV)  Take heed unto yourselves, lest ye forget the covenant of the LORD your God, which he made with you, and make you a graven image, or the likeness of any thing, which the LORD thy God hath forbidden thee. 24  For the LORD thy God is a consuming fire, even a jealous God. 25  When thou shalt beget children, and children’s children, and ye shall have remained long in the land, and shall corrupt yourselves, and make a graven image, or the likeness of any thing, and shall do evil in the sight of the LORD thy God, to provoke him to anger: 26  I call heaven and earth to witness against you this day, that ye shall soon utterly perish from off the land whereunto ye go over Jordan to possess it; ye shall not prolong your days upon it, but shall utterly be destroyed. 27  And the LORD shall scatter you among the nations, and ye shall be left few in number among the heathen, whither the LORD shall lead you. 28  And there ye shall serve gods, the work of men’s hands, wood and stone, which neither see, nor hear, nor eat, nor smell. 29   But if from thence thou shalt seek the LORD thy God, thou shalt find him, if thou seek him with all thy heart and with all thy soul. 30  When thou art in tribulation, and all these things are come upon thee, even in the latter days, if thou turn to the LORD thy God, and shalt be obedient unto his voice; 31   (For the LORD thy God is a merciful God;) he will not forsake thee, neither destroy thee, nor forget the covenant of thy fathers which he sware unto them.   
 (Deu 28:1 KJV)  And it shall come to pass, if thou shalt hearken diligently unto the voice of the LORD thy God, to observe and to do all his commandments which I command thee this day, that the LORD thy God will set thee on high above all nations of the earth:
(Deu 28:15 KJV)  But it shall come to pass, if thou wilt not hearken unto the voice of the LORD thy God, to observe to do all his commandments and his statutes which I command thee this day; that all these curses shall come upon thee, and overtake thee:…. (Deu 28:33 KJV)  The fruit of thy land, and all thy labours, shall a nation which thou knowest not eat up; and thou shalt be only oppressed and crushed alway:.. (Deu 28:48 KJV)  Therefore shalt thou serve thine enemies which the LORD shall send against thee, in hunger, and in thirst, and in nakedness, and in want of all things: and he shall put a yoke of iron upon thy neck, until he have destroyed thee… (Deu 28:52 KJV)  And he shall besiege thee in all thy gates, until thy high and fenced walls come down, wherein thou trustedst, throughout all thy land: and he shall besiege thee in all thy gates throughout all thy land, which the LORD thy God hath given thee… (Deu 28:63 KJV)  And it shall come to pass, that as the LORD rejoiced over you to do you good, and to multiply you; so the LORD will rejoice over you to destroy you, and to bring you to nought; and ye shall be plucked from off the land whither thou goest to possess it… (Deu 28:66 KJV)  And thy life shall hang in doubt before thee; and thou shalt fear day and night, and shalt have none assurance of thy life:

So Joshua took the entire land, just as the LORD had directed Moses, and he gave it as an inheritance to Israel according to their tribal divisions. Then the land had rest from war. (Joshua 11,23)

You gave them kingdoms and nations, allotting to them even the remotest frontiers… You made their sons as numerous as the stars in the sky, and you brought them into the land that you told their fathers to enter and possess. (Nehemiah 9,22-23) 
  
So the LORD gave Israel all the land he had sworn to give their forefathers, and they took possession of it and settled there. The LORD gave them rest on every side, just as he had sworn to their forefathers. Not one of their enemies withstood them; the LORD handed all their enemies over to them. Not one of all the Lord’s good promises to the house of Israel failed; every one was fulfilled. (Joshua 21,43-45)
 
Now who can falsely say that God’s promises to Israel have not yet been fulfilled? http://www.christianzionism.org/BibleSays/Sizer01.asp
  
“Therefore I also, after I heard of your faith in the Lord Jesus and your love for all the saints,  do not cease to give thanks for you, making mention of you in my prayers: that the God of our  Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give to you the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the  knowledge of Him, the eyes of your understanding being enlightened; that you may know what is  the hope of His calling, what are the riches of the glory of His inheritance in the saints, and what  is the exceeding greatness of His power toward us who believe, according to the working of His mighty power which He worked in Christ when He raised Him from the dead and seated Him at  His right hand in the heavenly places, far above all principality and power and might and  dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this age but also in that which is to come.”
-Eph 1:15-21
                  
Unanswered Questions? Or is the answer undeniable, too obvious?Why is there such a close relationship today between the Christian Right, the American political establishment and the State of Israel? Why after 40 years, does Israel continue to occupy territory in Lebanon (the Sheba Farms), Syria (the Golan Heights) and Palestine (the West Bank) while Syria has been pressured to withdraw from Lebanon? Why is Israel allowed to retain nuclear weapons while Iran is threatened with a pre-emptive attack for aspiring to obtain nuclear technology? And how have Britain and America become the focus of so much hate in the Arab world and the target for Islamic terrorism – despite out commitment to the rule of international law, democracy and human rights?

Christian Zionism is undoubtedly a dominant force shaping US foreign policy in the Middle East.

The Pew Research Centre recently discovered that 60% of evangelicals said they supported the state of Israel,  and 32% cited their religious beliefs as the primary reason for such support. But does the Bible support the Sate of Israel existence today?

Discovering what the Bible actually, truly  now has to say about the relationship between Israel and the Church, in history and prophecy, more then just an academic exercise.

 

Did the coming of Jesus, his death and resurrection and the founding of the Church, fulfill or postpone the past biblical prophecies concerning Israel? Is the Church central to God’s purposes on earth, or merely a temporary side show?

Covenantalism or Dispensationalism?

 
Covenantalists tend to see the coming of Jesus as the fulfillment of the promises made to Israel while dispensationalists tend to see it as the postponement of those promises.

Covenantalists believe the Bible teaches that God has one ‘chosen people’ called out from among the nations. Dispensationalists believe the Bible teaches that God has two separate and distinct peoples – the Church and Israel.

If Covenantalists emphasize the continuity within God’s progressive revelation, Dispensationalists emphasize the discontinuity, distinguishing seven ‘dispensations’ in biblical history when God has tested mankind in a different way, and each time they have failed.

Covenantalists tend to regard promises relating to the Land, Jerusalem and the temple as annulled or fulfilled in the Church. Dispensationalists tend to see them as still in force and either being, or about to be, fulfilled in Israel today.
 
Covenantalists tend to be neutral or positive about the future before the return of Jesus being either amillennial or postmillennial. Dispensationalists tend to be premillennial and pessimistic about the future.
 
I believe the dispensational framework has been artificially imposed on the Scriptures creating divisions that are not there and ignoring those that are there.
 
Judaism is a religious system. Israel is a sovereign nation. Zionism is a political system. These three are not synonymous.
  
I respect Judaism, repudiate anti-Semitism, encourage interfaith dialogue and defend Israel’s right to exist within borders recognised by the international community and agreed with her neighbours. But like many Jews, I disagree with a political system which gives preference to expatriate Jews born elsewhere in the world, while denying the same rights to the Arab Palestinians born in the country itself. Jimmy Carter is not alone in describing the Zionism practiced by the present government of Israel as a form of apartheid.

The apostle Peter, preaching after Pentecost, and citing Moses, similarly warned those who rejected Jesus, “Anyone who does not listen to him will be completely cut off from their people.” (Acts 3:23). Covenantalists believe there has only ever been one people of God – whether under the old or new covenant – and one way to God – by Jesus, grace alone and through faith alone.

Most of the Jews even today  and the Judaizers have refused God plan through the ages , that of Jesus being the messiah and they continue on with their own earthly, fleshly replacement, earthly goals, plans.
 
Yes, we must read the Bible literally. We must also read the Bible contextually.  We must read the Bible progressively. The Holy Spirit inspired the Bible, and he needs to teach it to us, not some mere man or women, and Jesus is still the center of all prophecies, and not mankind or the Jews. (Rev 19:10 KJV)  And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See thou do it not: I am thy fellow servant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.

Even the Apostles didn’t always do this straight away. They brought their Jewish presuppositions with them which sometimes falsely colored their hopes and expectations.

We too need the same illuminating work of the Holy Spirit as we read the Bible, to see the harmony and progression in God’s purposes. But to do that we need to pray and ask God to teach us and to also still read the Bible ourselves now.. not wrongfully let someone else supposedly read and interpret the Bible for us.
 
(2 Tim 2:15 KJV)  Study to show thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth. 16    But shun profane and vain babblings: for they will increase unto more ungodliness.

It is also this still important to rightfully also distinguishes, properly interpreting the valid prophetic and apocalyptic scriptures since  prophetic messages often differs from  the apocalyptic  messages. Sometimes Biblical books contain both the prophetic and the apocalyptic. The Book of Revelation is one example Prophetic and  apocalyptic literature like Revelation should be interpreted in harmony with the teachings of the entire Bible
 
Now there are two basic errors ultra-literalists make regarding the prophetic and apocalyptic literature: First, they ignore the historical setting of the passages and the way in which they have already been fulfilled. Second, they read back into the passages contemporary events and develop novel ways to interpret them as if they were speaking of present day readers. This heresy is not new.

Jesus and the apostles tell us quite plainly that some parts of the Hebrew Scriptures have been fulfilled, annulled or superseded.  The question is therefore not whether the promises of the Old Testament should be understood literally or allegorically. It is instead a question of whether they should be understood in terms of Old Covenant ‘shadow’ or in terms of New Covenant ‘reality’. 
 
When Christian writers forcefully interpret contemporary events in the light of prophecy, they run into errors and difficulties. For example,
– Hal Lindsey insisted that Russia’s place in history was predicted in the Bible but as Russia power declined, Lindsey switched his emphasis to Islamic Fundamentalism
-Traditionally some have held the view  ‘Babylon the Great’ (Revelation 14:8 and 17:5), variously interpreted as the Roman Empire, the Vatican, and the European Community. – but too many now  switched their Biblical  interpretations,  emphasis to Iraq,  Babylon being  rebuilt before the final battle of Armageddon  and who knows what to next?

The superficial appeal of these kind of interpretations are mostly  short-lived as the wreckage of previous false Prophetic claims do now testify evidentially.

For ultra-literalists, too often  the biblical text seems to need a little false personal adding to the word of God,  ‘enhancing’ to make their interpretation more obvious.  Ultra-literalists have perpetuated the false principle of ‘enhancing’ the text to reinforce their own mostly false interpretations. While the ultra-literalists Dispensationalist Bible Scholars claim to provide ‘consistent interpretation’, they nonetheless reach very different conclusions, meaning they rarely agree with each other, and even contradict each other mostly still.
 
Continued.. read these References 
  
For the Love of Zion (the Bible tells them so) (Seminar 1/5), by Dr. Stephen Sizer  Why is there such a close relationship today between the Christian Right, the American political establishment and the State of Israel? Why after 40 years, does Israel continue to occupy territory in Lebanon (the Sheba Farms), Syria (the Golan Heights) and Palestine (the West Bank) while Syria has been pressured to withdraw from Lebanon? Why is Israel allowed to retain nuclear weapons while Iran is threatened with a pre-emptive attack for aspiring to obtain nuclear technology? And how have Britain and America become the focus of so much hate in the Arab world and the target for Islamic terrorism – despite out commitment to the rule of international law, democracy and human rights? The answers to these questions remain inexplicable unless we factor in what is now probably the most influential and controversial movement amongst Christians today – Christian Zionism. Full Article Here
http://www.cc-vw.org/articles/zcs1.pdf
 
Israel and the Church: Who are God’s Chosen People? (Seminar 2/5), by Dr. Stephen Sizer  How often have you heard the Jewish people described as God’s ‘chosen people’? Probably so often that you have never even questioned it. It is so ingrained that to deny it is often seen as evidence of anti-Semitism. As is the assumption that God blesses and curses nations on the basis of how they treat Israel – which is sometimes used as a threat. This view goes back to Genesis 12:3. Jerry Falwell, for example, says God is blessing America because ‘America has been kind to the Jew.’1 He claims that God ‘will bless those who bless the Jews and curse whoever curses the Jews.’2 That is why Christians United or Israel conducts ‘a Night to Honor Israel’3 in as many cities as possible so that God will continue to bless America and Canada.
 
It may surprise you to discover that the New Testament never uses the term ‘chosen’ to describe the Jewish people. It is only used of those who follow Jesus. Does that mean God has two separate ‘chosen people’? Some like to think so. They are usually called ‘dispensationalists’ and this is a popular viewpoint among evangelicals in the United States.
In this chapter we will begin by looking at the evidence for two ‘chosen people’ and then tackle the ‘blessing and cursing’ issue. Then we will examine the term ‘Israel’ in the Old and New Testament. We shall then consider some of the biblical imagery God uses to describe his relationship to his people such as the analogy of the vine and the vineyard. We also need to define what we mean by words like ‘Jew’, ‘chosen’ and ‘children of God’. Full Article Here
http://www.cc-vw.org/articles/zcs2.pdf

The Promised Land – From the Nile to the Euphrates? (Seminar 3/5), by Dr. Stephen Sizer  In this chapter we will consider what the Bible has to say about the significance and purposes of the Promised Land as well its geographical extent. Then we will look at whether the land was intended as an ‘everlasting possession’ of the Jewish people or whether they were only temporary residents. Then we will examine the terms under which they were allowed to return after the exile, and whether the kingdom was nationalistic or universal. Finally we must consider what Jesus and the apostles have to say about all this. Full Article Here
http://www.cc-vw.org/articles/zcs3.pdf

Battle for Jerusalem: The Eternal Capital of the Jews? (Seminar 4/5), by Dr. Stephen Sizer  Many evangelicals, especially in America, accept unthinkingly the Zionist mantra that Jerusalem is the undivided, eternal and exclusive capital of the State of Israel. However, Jerusalem existed before the time of the Israelites. Today, Jerusalem lies at the heart of three world faiths – Judaism, Islam and Christianity. Israelis regard it as their capital. Palestinians do so also. Attempts to reach agreement in the wider Arab-Israeli conflict have partly stumbled over the contested status of Jerusalem. Jewish Zionists and their Christian supporters are strongly opposed to joint sovereignty or the recognition of East Jerusalem as the capital of Palestine. It seems time is on their side. The annexation of the Old City, the aggressive and illegal settlement programme, the systematic demolition of many Arab homes and the construction of the Separation Barrier have all created ‘facts on the ground’ in Jerusalem. Christian and Jewish Zionists also claim a higher mandate for this agenda – the Word of God.  Full Article Here
http://www.cc-vw.org/articles/zcs4.pdf
The Coming Last Day’s Temple – Ready to Rebuild? (Seminar 5/5), by Dr. Stephen Sizer Just 500 metres by 300 metres, the Temple Mount, or Haram Al Sharif as it is called in Arabic, is probably the most disputed plot of land on earth. Hal Lindsey claims, ‘I believe the fate of the world will be determined by an ancient feud over 35 acres of land.’  Many Christians share the belief that the Islamic shrines must be destroyed and that a Jewish Temple must and will be rebuilt – very soon. But this won’t be a museum replica of the one king Solomon built or be just another attraction for pilgrims to the Holy Land. No, this Temple will be built for one purpose and one purpose only – for bloody animal sacrifices, and lots of them. In this chapter we want to explore the case for rebuilding the Jewish Temple; consider whether the Bible predicts such an event; and if so, where and how it might be built. We will then look at what the New Testament has to say on the subject and some of the implications for Christianity should the Jewish Temple be rebuilt. Finally, we will reveal that the Temple is actually under construction (but don’t peep). http://www.cc-vw.org/articles/zcs5.pdf
do see also http://www.cc-vw.org/articles/zcs6.pdf   Overture to Armageddon: Want to be Left Behind?
Christian Zionists of the Dispensationalist variety tend to make absolute claims for their interpretation of key biblical texts. What serious students of the Bible have long known, however, is that there are different ways of reading the same texts. This is particularly true of the more difficult passages of scripture related to the Second Coming of Christ. Click on the article title to go directly to the full article, or on the author’s name to go to a summary/lead-in 
 
  
Article Title Author
An Alternative Evangelical Reading of Scripture Burge, Gary M, PhD
The Land in the New Testament Devenish, David
Distinction Between Israel and the Church Gerstner, John
Christ is Coming? Christ is Here! Moody, Stan
The Meaning of the Abrahamic Covenant (Genesis 12) Sizer, Stephen
For the Love of Zion: The Bible tells them so. (Seminar 1/5) Sizer, Stephen
Israel and the Church: Who are God’s chosen people? (Seminar 2/5) Sizer, Stephen
The Promised Land: From the Nile to the Euphrates? (Seminar 3/5) Sizer, Stephen
Battle for Jerusalem: The Eternal Capital of the Jews? (Seminar 4/5) Sizer, Stephen
The Coming Last Day’s Temple: Ready to Rebuild? (Seminar 5/5) Sizer, Stephen
The Rapture? (I Thessalonians 4: 15-18) Swire, Father Daniel
The Use of Scripture in Christian Zionism: a critical examination Tilling, Chris
Christian Approaches to the State of Israel Wilson, John M.
  
Summaries

The Land in the New Testament, by David Devenish What does the New Testament teach about the land of Israel? Answer: absolutely nothing. There are no references to the importance of the land or of Jerusalem as a ‘holy city’. Some would say that this is simply an argument from silence and that there are sufficient promises in the Old Testament to establish the land as belonging to the Jewish people without the need for New Testament confirmation. However, not only is there silence about the land but the whole tenor of the New Testament message and revelation of God’s saving purpose amongst His people points in a different direction.  To a Samaritan, despised by the Jews, Jesus makes special places of worship (including Jerusalem) a redundant concept (John 4:21). When marveling at the faith of a Gentile centurion, Jesus applied to the gathering in of Gentile peoples from all over the world the Old Testament promises of the bringing of God’s people from the east and west into the promised blessings alongside Abraham, Isaac and Jacob (Matt. 8:11).   

An Alternative Evangelical Reading of Scripture, By Gary M Burge, PhD In Genesis 12, 15 and 17 God promises the Holy Land to Abraham and his descendents. To Christian Zionists this promise of land inheritance was permanent and unconditional. And it is as true in Biblical times as it is today. This means that for Christian Zionists, the covenant of Abraham continues to be in play today . And as Christians this forces them to have what we call a “two covenant” theology: one covenant for the Jews and one for Christians operates in the church. In a word, the work of Christ does not replace or supplant the Jewish covenant. Reformed theologians (like myself) believe that something decisive happened in Christ. His covenant affected not simply the covenant of Moses – making a new and timeless form of salvation – but it also affected every Jewish covenant, including Abraham’s covenant. Christ fulfills the expectations of Jewish covenant life and renews the people of God rooted in the OT and Judaism. Thus Jesus is a new temple, the new Israel, there are 12 tribes/apostles, etc.
 
The Dispensational Distinction Between Israel and the Church, by John Gerstner  Perhaps the central doctrine of dispensationalism is the distinction between Israel and the church. Dispensationalism sees Israel as an earthly people with earthly promises, and the church as a heavenly people with heavenly promises. Membership in Israel is by natural birth.15 One enters the church by supernatural birth. Dispensationalists view Israel and the church as having distinct eternal destinies. Israel will receive an eternal earthly Kingdom, and the church an eternal heavenly Kingdom. Darby, the father of dispensationalism, stated the distinction in the clearest of terms: “The Jewish nation is never to enter the church.”16
Ryrie considers this the most important dispensational distinction, and approves the statement that… “the basic promise of Dispensationalism is two purposes of God expressed in the formation of two peoples who maintain their distinction throughout eternity.”17 In contrast, Christian theology has always maintained the essential continuity of Israel and the church. The elect of all the ages are seen as one people, with one Savior, one destiny. This continuity can be shown by examining a few Old Testament prophesies with their fulfillment. Dispensationalists admit that if the church can be shown to be fulfilling promises made to Israel their system is doomed. If the church is fulfilling Israel’s promises as contained in the new covenant or anywhere in the Scriptures, then [dispensational] premillennialism is condemned.18
  

Christ is Coming?  Christ is here!, by Stan Moody, PhD, To properly study Christian Zionism, it is critical to examine certain presuppositions. Universally accepted among Evangelicals is the dogma that Christ’s so-called Second Coming will be personal, corporeal and visible. Once we begin from that premise, there is no alternative than to ask, “Where?” and “When?” The “How” and “Why” become subordinate.  Thus, all our time is spent on the timing and locus of the event rather than on its nature. Even efforts to counter the extremism of Christian Zionism emanate from the assumption that Jesus has to return at some concrete/specific, cataclysmic moment in human history to rescue the world from the weight of its own sin. An inconvenient truth is that this was the mission of the First Advent. Men of Galilee, why do you stand here looking into the sky? This same Jesus, who has been taken from you, will come back in the same way you have seen him go into heaven (Acts 1:11 NIV). For the grace of God has appeared, bringing salvation to all men, instructing us to deny ungodliness and worldly desires and to live sensibly, righteously and godly in the present age, looking for the blessed hope and the appearing of the glory of our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ (Titus 2:11-13 NASV).

The Meaning of the Abrahamic Covenant (Genesis 12), by Dr. Stephen Sizer  We must begin our consideration of the Abrahamic Covenant not in Genesis 12 but Genesis 2. The covenant began with Gods creation of a paradise, represented in the garden. This was the place where people could receive all of God’s blessings and commune in fellowship with Him. This is where the image of land begins in the Bible. This land of paradise was lost in the Fall but a foretaste of heaven is reflected in the imagery of the promise made to Abraham.
The Lord had said to Abram, “Leave your country, your people and your father’s household and go to the land I will show you. (Genesis 12:1)  When Abram was ninety-nine years old, the Lord appeared to him and said, “I am God Almighty; walk before me and be blameless. I will confirm my covenant between me and you and will greatly increase your numbers”. Abram fell facedown, and God said to him, “As for me, this is my covenant with you: You will be the father of many nations. No longer will you be called Abram; your name will be Abraham, for I have made you a father of many nations. I will make you very fruitful; I will make nations of you, and kings will come from you. I will establish my covenant as an everlasting covenant between me and you and your descendants after you for the generations to come, to be your God and the God of your descendants after you. The whole land of Canaan, where you are now an alien, I will give as an everlasting possession to you and your descendants after you; and I will be their God.” (Genesis 17:1-8)

The Rapture? (I Thessalonians 4: 15-18), by Father Daniel Swire The doctrine of a “Rapture” does not originate in the book of the Revelation. The word “rapture” is not actually found anywhere in any English translations of the Bible. It comes from the Latina word, rapere, which is is usually translated “caught up” in the English translations of 1 Thessalonians 4:17.   Here is what we read in I Thessalonians 4: 15-18: For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord. Therefore comfort one another with these words. (1 Thessalonians 4:15-18)

The use of Scripture in Christian Zionism: a critical examination, by Chris Tilling In the next few posts I shall discuss the handling of Scripture in Christian Zionism (CZ). I will suggest it is marked by a proof-texting mentality that not only misunderstands the nature of biblical prophecy, but also displays a naïve and inconsistent hermeneutic. In a later post in this series I’ll also suggest why this subject isn’t merely a theological curiosity – and something best left alone – but impacts world politics. In fact, I suggest it also negatively distracts discipleship to Jesus and thus needs to be challenged. And the use of Scripture in Christian Zionism gets right to the heart of the problem, hence the focus of this small series.

Christian Approaches to the State of Israel, by John M Wilson Jews have an ongoing role in the furthering of God’s ultimate redemptive purposes. But no matter what standard or position one adopts, Christians must not be blind to Joseph Klausner’s objection that Christianity has sought to remove the national and political aspects of the prophetic hope (The Messianic Idea in Israel, p. 10). God works through the sacred and the secular. . . .[I]f God can call a pagan Persian named Cyrus ‘his anointed’ (Isa. 45:1), and another pagan king, Nebuchadnezzar, ‘my servant’ (Jer. 25:9), and accomplish his holy purposes among the nations through both, who can say what plans God may yet have in store for those who from of old have been his people? (ibid, p. 268). Real estate theology is, at best, precarious theology. . . .For centuries Jews suffered discrimination and victimization at the hands of Christians whose theological convictions seemed to permit [encourage] such unjust activity. . . .Therefore, we conclude, as long as Arabs and Jews argue from nonnegotiable theological absolutes, human beings can offer little hope for peace

 
There actually is no Biblical promised prophecy, a promised second return of the Jews to Israel in the Old Testament or next in the whole Bible now too.  after Israel’s, Jews   second dispersion from Israel by the Romans in 70 ad.. . Not even one New testament Bible verse even for even the Jewish return in 1948..  Do now try prove me wrong..
It is unbelievable, undeniable  that the professing Christian people who do not know the Bible can be so easily deceived, led astray too by many others, pastors and Jewish persons, Zionists included.. And had most people most Christians read the Bible for themselves they would have known the whole truth and would not have been  so easily misled by others. 
 
see also  

 

The Bible and the Jews

Ten Old testament Biblical Prophecies for certainty Fulfilled Today regarding the Jews

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(Luke 12:53 KJV)  The father shall be divided against the son, and the son against the father; the mother against the daughter, and the daughter against the mother; the mother in law against her daughter in law, and the daughter in law against her mother in law.

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Firstly any one who looks at the subject of prophecy, a real genuine Bible student knows that too many Jews ,who can only use the old testament, and there is almost no new testament substantiation for it, still the Jews,  and many others have wrongfully now Distorted Biblical Prophecy Interpretation after the time of Jesus Christ to suit their false Jewish’s ends, a Jewish purpose, for they like Judas they betray Jesus Christ by these acts for Jesus next made it clear the second Jewish Kingdom of God was not in this world..  (John 18:36 KJV)  Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.
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These 10 Bible prophecies fulfilled at least, there are more too, though had said that Israel would become a country, that it would be destroyed, that the Jews would be scattered worldwide and persecuted, that the Jews would have a worldwide impact, and that they would next return to  these prophecies were  fulfilled in the old Testament times
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1. The Jews would have their own country
 
Bible passage: Genesis 15:18 (Gen 15:18 KJV)  In the same day the LORD made a covenant with Abram, saying, Unto thy seed have I given this land, from the river of Egypt unto the great river, the river Euphrates:
Fulfilled: 1400 BC  In Genesis 15:18, the Bible said the descendants of Abraham (Abram) would have their own country, between Egypt and the Euphrates. This prophecy has been fulfilled . About 3400 years ago, the Jews first established Israel. Then, about 2900 years ago, Israel divided into two kingdoms, called Judah and Israel. Both kingdoms were later conquered by the Assyrians and Babylonians.
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On that day the Lord made a covenant with Abram and said, “To your descendants I give this land, from the river of Egypt to the great river, the Euphrates…”
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The Jews , Christian who lie that this prophecies was also refullfilled in 1948 need to be remind that they do not have the land from from the river of Egypt unto the great river, the river Euphrates: and there was no second promised return made by Jesus or the Apostles
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2. Jacob saw a vision of Israel’s future
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Bible passage: (Gen 28:10 KJV)  And Jacob went out from Beersheba, and went toward Haran.  11  And he lighted upon a certain place, and tarried there all night, because the sun was set; and he took of the stones of that place, and put them for his pillows, and lay down in that place to sleep. 12  And he dreamed, and behold a ladder set up on the earth, and the top of it reached to heaven: and behold the angels of God ascending and descending on it.13  And, behold, the LORD stood above it, and said, I am the LORD God of Abraham thy father, and the God of Isaac: the land whereon thou liest, to thee will I give it, and to thy seed; 14   And thy seed shall be as the dust of the earth, and thou shalt spread abroad to the west, and to the east, and to the north, and to the south: and in thee and in thy seed shall all the families of the earth be blessed. 15   And, behold, I am with thee, and will keep thee in all places whither thou goest, and will bring thee again into this land; for I will not leave thee, until I have done that which I have spoken to thee of.

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Written: perhaps 1400 BC Fulfilled: Throughout history In Genesis 28:10-15, the Bible says that Jacob, who lived about 4000 years ago, received a vision from God about the future of his descendants (the Jews). The vision accurately foretold the future of the Jews. Here is our summary of Jacob’s vision: The Jews would have Israel as their own country. This was fulfilled about 3400 years ago when the Jews first established Israel.
The Jews would be scattered worldwide. This was fulfilled when the Jews were forced out of Israel more than 2500 years ago by the Assyrians and Babylonians and again about 1900 years ago by the Romans.
The Jews and the seed, the Arabs, and the Christians would have a worldwide impact. Jews have had a tremendous worldwide impact in science, art, literature, economics, music and theology. The worldwide spread of Christianity began about 2000 years ago by a group of Jews who were followers of Jesus.
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Here is Genesis 28:10-15 Jacob … had a dream in which he saw a stairway resting on the earth, with its top reaching to heaven, and the angels of God were ascending and descending on it. There above it stood the Lord, and he said: “I am the Lord, the God of your father Abraham and the God of Isaac. I will give you and your descendants the land on which you are lying. Your descendants will be like the dust of the earth, and you will spread out to the west and to the east, to the north and to the south. All peoples on earth will be blessed through you and your offspring. I am with you and will watch over you wherever you go, and I will bring you back to this land. I will not leave you until I have done what I have promised you.”
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3. God will clearly save the Jews, their seeds,  and destroy their enemies
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Bible passage: Jeremiah 30:11 I am with you and will save you,’ declares the Lord. `Though I completely destroy all the nations among which I scatter you, I will not completely destroy you. I will discipline you but only with justice; I will not let you go entirely unpunished.’ Written: sometime from 626 to about 586 BC
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Fulfilled: Throughout history
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In Jeremiah 30:11, the prophet Jeremiah said the enemies of Israel will be destroyed but that the Jews will never perish. History has many examples of how nations have tried to destroy Israel and the Jews:
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In about 721 BC (about 2700 years ago), Assyria destroyed the northern kingdom of Israel. They tortured, killed and exiled many Jews.
In 586 BC (about 2600 years ago), Babylon destroyed the southern kingdom of Judah. They killed and exiled many Jews.
In 70 AD (about 1900 years ago), the Romans killed an estimated 1.1 million Jews and destroyed Jerusalem and the Temple.
In 135 AD, the Romans killed an estimated 580,000 Jews and exiled many others.
In the 1930s and 1940s, the Nazis killed an estimated 6 million Jews. The Nazi plan, called the “final solution,” was to kill all Jews.
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Israel again is an independent country. But, the empires of the Nazis, Romans, Babylonians and Assyrians have vanished. Today, we can judge with our own eyes as to whether Jeremiah was correct when he said, 2600 years ago, that the enemies of the Jews would be destroyed, but that the Jews would be preserved.
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4. The Jews and their seeds too,  would continually, always next face many disasters and difficulties
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Bible passage: (Deu 31:16 KJV)  And the LORD said unto Moses, Behold, thou shalt sleep with thy fathers; and this people will rise up, and go a whoring after the gods of the strangers of the land, whither they go to be among them, and will forsake me, and break my covenant which I have made with them. 17    Then my anger shall be kindled against them in that day, and I will forsake them, and I will hide my face from them, and they shall be devoured, and many evils and troubles shall befall them; so that they will say in that day, Are not these evils come upon us, because our God is not among us?
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Written: perhaps 1400 BC Fulfilled: Throughout history
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In Deuteronomy 31:16-17, the Bible said that the Jews would face many difficulties if they turned away from God. And, according to the Bible, many people in ancient Israel did at times turn away from God and worship the false gods of pagan Gentiles. This prophecy of persecution has been fulfilled many times. During the past 1900 years in Europe, for example, Jews were often heavily taxed, robbed of their possessions, stripped of their civil rights, forced into ghettos, tortured and slaughtered. Government leaders and church leaders at times banished the Jews from living in Spain, England, France, Belgium and Italy. During the Crusades, Jewish villages were often destroyed and men, women and children were burned alive. Those centuries of persecutions culminated with the Holocaust of the 1930s and 1940s, when the Nazis killed an estimated 6 million Jews. When Israel reclaimed independence in 1948, the surrounding countries invaded and tried to destroy the tiny nation.
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5. The Jews would be scattered worldwide
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Bible passage: Deuteronomy 28:64 Then the Lord will scatter you among all nations, from one end of the earth to the other. There you will worship other gods–gods of wood and stone, which neither you nor your fathers have known.
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Bible passage: Genesis 12:2-3  Written: perhaps 1400 BC “I will make you into a great nation and I will bless you; I will make your name great, and you will be a blessing. I will bless those who bless you, and whoever curses you I will curse; and all peoples on earth will be blessed through you.”
Fulfilled: Throughout history In Genesis 12:2-3, and in Genesis 28:10-15, the Bible said that the descendants of Abraham and the descendants of Abraham’s grandson, Jacob, would be a blessing for people worldwide. Jacob is the father of the 12 Tribes of Israel (the Jews)but also is the same  father of the Arabs and the Christians too..
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 6. The Jews , their seeds included, would have a worldwide impact
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Bible passage: Genesis 12:2-3 “I will make you into a great nation and I will bless you; I will make your name great, and you will be a blessing. I will bless those who bless you, and whoever curses you I will curse; and all peoples on earth will be blessed through you.”Written: perhaps 1400 BC
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Fulfilled: Throughout history In Genesis 12:2-3, and in Genesis 28:10-15, the Bible said that the descendants of Abraham and the descendants of Abraham’s grandson, Jacob, would be a blessing for people worldwide. Jacob is the father of the 12 Tribes of Israel (the Jews), the Arabs, and the Christians too

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7. Israel would be  partitioned by other nations

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Written: perhaps 1400 BC  Fulfilled: 721 BC, 586 BC, 70 AD, 135 AD
In Deuteronomy 28:64, the Bible said the Jews would be scattered worldwide. This prophecy has certainly been fulfilled. Take a look at the explanation of the Jewish “Diaspora,” which means “scattering,” from the Columbia Encyclopedia, Fifth Edition: “… by 70 A.D. Jewish communities existed in Babylonia, Syria, Egypt, Cyrene, Asia Minor, Greece, and Rome. Jews followed the Romans into Europe and from Persia and Babylonia spread as far east as China. In modern times, Jews have migrated to the Americas, South Africa, and Australia. The Jewish population of Central and Eastern Europe, until World War II the largest in the world, was decimated in the Holocaust. Despite the creation of the state of Israel in 1948, the vast majority of the Jewish people remain scattered in the Diaspora, notably in North America, Europe,  Russia, and Ukraine.” This will remain so until the return of Jesus Christ..
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Bible passage: Joel 3:2  Written: about 400 BC I will gather all nations and bring them down to the Valley of Jehoshaphat. There I will enter into judgment against them concerning my inheritance, my people Israel, for they scattered my people among the nations and divided up my land.
(NOTE: “Jehoshaphat” means “the Lord judges.”)

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Fulfilled: 1900s In Joel 3:2, the prophet said that the nations of the world will be judged for having scattered the people of Israel and for having “divided up” (or “parted” or “partitioned”) the land of Israel. Christian scholars believe that this is a prophecy that will be further fulfilled during the End Times. But, portions of the prophecy already have been fulfilled. The Jews have been scattered to nations throughout the world, and the nations of the world have divided up the land of Israel.
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In addition on November 29, 1947, when the United Nations General Assembly approved a motion to partition the land, which at that time was called “Palestine.” The partition plan divided the land into two separate states, one for Jewish people and another for Arab people. Today, that partitioning is interlocked with many political problems as the Jews seek to reclaim the land promised to them in the Bible (see Genesis 15:18, Genesis 28:10-17 and Genesis 35:9-12), and the Arabs seek to create a homeland for “Palestinians” – Arabs who have lived in that land for many generations.

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But God is not against this Palestinian Partition.. (Psa 133:1 KJV)  A Song of degrees of David. Behold, how good and how pleasant it is for brethren to dwell together in unity !2  It is like the precious ointment upon the head, that ran down upon the beard, even Aaron’s beard: that went down to the skirts of his garments; 3 As the dew of Hermon, and as the dew that descended upon the mountains of Zion: for there the LORD commanded the blessing, even life for evermore. (Gen 16:12 KJV)  And he will be a wild man; his hand will be against every man, and every man’s hand against him; and he shall dwell in the presence of all his brethren.   (Gen 16:10 KJV)  And the angel of the LORD said unto her,( Hagar)  I will multiply thy seed ( Arabs) exceedingly, that it shall not be numbered for multitude.

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8. Israel would be restored and repopulated
 
Bible passage:  Ezekiel 36:8-10 “`But you, O mountains of Israel, will produce branches and fruit for my people Israel, for they will soon come home. I am concerned for you and will look on you with favor; you will be plowed and sown, and I will multiply the number of people upon you, even the whole house of Israel. The towns will be inhabited and the ruins rebuilt.
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Written: between 593-571 BC
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Fulfilled: 2600 years ago  In Ezekiel 36:8-10, the prophet Ezekiel said that the Jews would return, rebuild and repopulate their fallen cities. Ezekiel, according to the Bible, lived about 2600 years ago during the time of the Babylonian Captivity, when many Jews, including Ezekiel, were taken as captives to Babylon. After the Babylonian Captivity ended, many Jews left Babylon and returned to their homeland. There is no New testament Biblical prediction of a second return after their Biblically predicted expulsion from Israel by the Romans though.

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9. Jesus’ own life was foreshadowed by the prophet Isaiah

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Bible passage: Isaiah 42:1-9   “Here is my servant, whom I uphold, my chosen one in whom I delight; I will put my Spirit on him and he will bring justice to the nations. … In faithfulness he will bring forth justice; he will not falter or be discouraged till he establishes justice on earth. … “I, the Lord, have called you in righteousness; I will take hold of your hand. I will keep you and will make you to be a covenant for the people and a light for the Gentiles, to open eyes that are blind, to free captives from prison and to release from the dungeon those who sit in darkness. “I am the Lord; that is my name! I will not give my glory to another or my praise to idols. See, the former things have taken place, and new things I declare; before they spring into being I announce them to you.”
Written: perhaps between 701-681 BC  Fulfilled: About 2000 years ago
In Isaiah 42:1-9, the prophet Isaiah speaks of a Jewish servant of God who will be a light to the Gentiles (non-Jews) and bring justice to the world.  Jesus Christ is the fulfillment of this promise. Jesus’ teachings govern the lives of Christians throughout the world. There are an estimated 2 billion Christians worldwide. More people follow the teachings of Jesus than those of any other person in history.
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 10. Jesus said His words would never be forgotten
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Bible passage:  ” Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will never pass away.”

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Luke 21:335  And as some spake of the temple, how it was adorned with goodly stones and gifts, he said,
6  As for these things which ye behold, the days will come, in the which there shall not be left one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.
7  And they asked him, saying, Master, but when shall these things be? and what sign will there be when these things shall come to pass?
8  And he said, Take heed that ye be not deceived: for many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and the time draweth near: go ye not therefore after them.
9  But when ye shall hear of wars and commotions, be not terrified: for these things must first come to pass; but the end is not by and by.
10  Then said he unto them, Nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom:
11  And great earthquakes shall be in divers places, and famines, and pestilences; and fearful sights and great signs shall there be from heaven.
12  But before all these, they shall lay their hands on you, and persecute you, delivering you up to the synagogues, and into prisons, being brought before kings and rulers for my name’s sake.
13  And it shall turn to you for a testimony.
14  Settle it therefore in your hearts, not to meditate before what ye shall answer:
15  For I will give you a mouth and wisdom, which all your adversaries shall not be able to gainsay nor resist.
16  And ye shall be betrayed both by parents, and brethren, and kinsfolks, and friends; and some of you shall they cause to be put to death.
17  And ye shall be hated of all men for my name’s sake.
18  But there shall not an hair of your head perish.
19  In your patience possess ye your souls.
20  And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh.
21  Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto.
22  For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled.
23  But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people.
24  And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.
25  And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars; and upon the earth distress of nations, with perplexity; the sea and the waves roaring;
26  Men’s hearts failing them for fear, and for looking after those things which are coming on the earth: for the powers of heaven shall be shaken.
27  And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory.
28  And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.
29  And he spake to them a parable; Behold the fig tree, and all the trees;
30  When they now shoot forth, ye see and know of your own selves that summer is now nigh at hand.
31  So likewise ye, when ye see these things come to pass, know ye that the kingdom of God is nigh at hand.
32  Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass away, till all be fulfilled.
33  Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away.
34  And take heed to yourselves, lest at any time your hearts be overcharged with surfeiting, and drunkenness, and cares of this life, and so that day come upon you unawares.
35  For as a snare shall it come on all them that dwell on the face of the whole earth.
36  Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.

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Written: about 30 AD
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Partially Fulfilled: At this very moment In Luke 21:33, Jesus said that regardless of what happens to the world, His words will never be forgotten. Here we are 2000 years later and the words of Jesus are all around us: There are 2 billion Christians worldwide and the Bible is most circulated book in the world. Of all the people who have ever lived, can you think of a single person who could have made this claim more effectively than Jesus – that his words would never be forgotten?

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Now read the whole Bible, the New testament included,  for yourself, do not even believe what others do say now the Bible says, for many have false, hidden agendas and do twist the truths now, Jews and false Christians included.

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It should be of note, interest to all Bible students, that the Christian Church, the bride of Christ, the final Jew/fish seed, was not mentioned directly in the old testament but only in the new testament. All persons thus, Arab, Jewish, gentile can only go to heaven to be with God, can be saved from their sins thus too, by Jesus Christ alone.
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*Jews, Israel for a start falsely, to try to get the support of others, even like to use the term anti Semite often, as a false diversion  even for a start,  as  they here supposedly want to say that they alone are not the objects of the hate, racial  attack but so are the others..  Although the term anti-Semitism has wide currency, it is regarded  as a misnomer, falsely now  implying discrimination against all Semites, including all Arabs and other peoples, who now firstly are not the clear targets of anti-Semitism today as it is usually the fact. It is not the past Jewish culture being attacked now too, but rather their presently specific now bad  personal acts, poor values associated with Israel, especially when they the Jews too often and  falsely, undeniably too now, the chosen ones,   tend to think they are now really superior to all other nations too and they can do what they want, for they can do no wrong. Rather this is not so in reality, they the Jews too can be held accountable for their too often now bad acts as well… even against the Palestinians.
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I really get sick every time I hear preachers such as John Hagee and Jerry Falwell demonize the Arab people, while glorifying the Jews. http://witnessed.wordpress.com/2008/07/28/john-hagee%e2%80%99s-israel-heresy/

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” Those who question the legitimacy of Israel’s actions are immediately labelled anti-Semitic by some quarters, effectively undermining the turn of phrase by using it in this context. We are right to question the state of Israel’s actions and I am not anti-Semitic for doing so. I think the religious fundamentalism exhibited by certain Zionist and Orthodox Jewish groups needs to be dealt with in a similar manner to Islamic fundamentalism, I don’t see the distinction between the two, both are equally repulsive. ” http://mccainvrsobama.wordpress.com/2010/09/23/even-as-to-the-promised-land/

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Too many fundamentals, professing Christians now falsely do that the establishment of the State of Israel in 1948 was prophesied in Scripture while there is no direct support of this in the New Testament Bible even still. Zionism, on the other hand, “is a secularist, largely atheistic ideology” that emerged in the late 19th century. God still does not require the human input to fulfill his own prophecies. Now too many Christian Zionists, extremists do falsely do now believe that in order to fulfill all of the Biblical prophecy, Israel must next conquer most of the Middle East. And anyone watched the mostly self centered, get richer TV evangelists such as a Pat Robertson or John Hagee and their distorted sermons scenarios involving the future “Rapture,” Jesus Christ and also Israel, should also quickly firstly now realize that these false prophets are not only fleecing, scaring their flock to give more money but falsely are into worshipping the false idol of Israel. .John Hagee pays himself over a million dollars a year in TAX FREE money while having several palaces to live in, like the $2.1 million 7,969-acre ranch outside Brackettville, Texas , with five lodges, including a “main lodge” and a gun locker.;Once considered a small marginal doctrine among evangelicals, the false dispensationalist theology of Christian Zionism has greatly escalated, ironically falsely with the help of jess, Messianic Jews, Judaizers and many others too. The reality still is that the parable of the vineyard (Matt 21:33-43) clearly shows that the Christian Church totally now rather succumbs all of the past promises made to Israel. Be careful about accepting anyone’s word about Christian Zionism do first read the Bible, New Testament for yourself and know the truth rather. http://witnessed.wordpress.com/2008/07/29/the-2-promised-returns/

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Do see also
– as to what it means to be chosen
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For certainty also because of the demonic opposition the devil will try to discourage you from finding out reading about the Holy spirit, Charismatics, Pentecostals and the Bible. I know I have experienced this myself the last  40 years. So my sites will reflect, show you what I have learned, found out on these subjects for a start.

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There will come another antichrist still  that will kick the Jews out of Israel,  disperse them   as well, and persecute them again

Dispensationalist , Plymouth Brethren

 
The Dispensationalist , Plymouth  Brethren false views on sins, accountability, grace, Israel and much more too is an undeniable fact even if they lie and try falsey to say it is Authentic Christianity, or the Good News, the Gospel, that for sure it is not! In the Western  world today, too many Brethren Christians dare not walk openly or share their faith “for fear of the Jews” and others , but not all of them. (Prov 28:1 KJV)  The wicked flee when no man pursueth: but the righteous are bold as a lion. https://postedat.wordpress.com/2010/05/30/the-revisionists/
 
Plymouth Brethren it seems they  like to hide from what they really are and teach..  They say the want to be known as the  “No Name Christian Church”, but they are often called  “PB Church”, “PBer’s”, “The Brethren Church”, “Darbyites” and such like.  The history books often refer to them as Plymouth Brethren or those who started the Plymouth Brethren movement.  This Plymouth Brethren label came to be used in the early 1800s because an assembly of Christians gathered in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ in Plymouth England had a number of gifted preachers that traveled and preached throughout the country and because they were from the town of Plymouth, people would often refer to them as one of those brethren from Plymouth. 
 
While the Brethren even say they Believe the Bible is the Word of God, they too  clearly do have this unholy, desperate and complicated need to reinterpret almost every  passages of the Bible suitable to their own liking. It is impossible to give a concise, succinct definition of Dispensationalism today because of the many changes among dispensational teachers. There is more than one view of Dispensationalism today. Therefore, the old definition found in the Scofield Bible is no longer accurate or adequate: “A dispensation is a period of time during which a man is tested in respect of obedience to some specific revelation of the will of God” (Scofield Reference Bible, p. 5, note 4 )so  it is impossible to give a concise and succinct definition of Dispensationalism, and if Darby, Scofield, or even Chafer were to return today, they would be bewildered by the widely divergent stances of those still called dispensationalists. So clearly Dispensationalism cannot be defined as a return to the new testament biblical, beliefs, doctrines any longer too. “Darby and many others Brrthren had held that the church of God would escape the days of the end [i.e., the days of the great tribulation]; Newton, Tregelles, George Müller, and others believed the church will go through that period; R. C. Chapman, Groves, and Lady Powerscourt thought that not all believers will share in the first resurrection and the millennial kingdom…. “

Because of the dogmatic insistence of Darby and his followers that others heed their instructions, which they felt to be the Spirit’s leading, they reaped divisions in abundance

Too many relgious groups who still do  teach unacceptable falsehoods try to proclaim also that they are real Christians other wise who would even listen to them ,even their false Gospel of the dispensational method of interpretation of the Bible. Yes  many other relgious groups falsey also try to say that they are Christians now including the clearly  false cults of Mormons, Seventh Day Adventists, Jehovah Witnesses, and the other even once called real Christians Churches who have basically departed from  the  true faith in Jesus Christ such as the  Anglican, the Catholics, Mennonites and some of the others too.

The false churches and Cults are classic experts in brainwashing techniques.  Jehovah’s Witnesses is another cult that uses brainwashing techniques with great success. Any member who dares to leave the organization is shunned by close family members, and this intimidation is as intense as one can possibly imagine. Divorce,  isolation,  Shunning is a masterful false bondage technique.

Another false group are the Messianic Jews. The modern day Judaizers in the Christian church are those in the “Torah Keeper” movement. Many Christian churches falsely teach that the old testament Commandments also do apply today. This false doctrine of theirs is not  baffling since they want to falsely keep and exalt their old culture, cultural beliefs, and are not willing to pay the price to follow after Jesus Christ alone,  and all of the  Scripture written by the Apostle Paul for the church today is clearly against it too. They come up with twisted explanations and they clearly also now do  fall into false teaching. They falsely believe that legalism is the only method possible for a person to resist a sinful lifestyle. These church Pastors, Ministers and Reverends ignore the power of the indwelling Holy Spirit in the born again believer. The Apostle Paul taught that legalism is doomed to failure. Submitting to the guidance of the Holy Spirit actually fulfills the requirements of the ritual, sacrificial Law too. Legalistic preachers typically don’t accept repentance from members in the church. The repentant member is simply kicked out no matter what he does. This unbiblical practice of expecting all members to be perfectly sinless leads to denial of sin throughout the congregation. The denial of sin results in a sinful pride, a pattern of lying and a refusal to admit or repent of anything.  All legalists lead people away from the gospel and away from Christ by focusing on their legalistic false doctrines and works instead of the gospel.” 

Dispensationalists like also to  teach that all who place their faith and trust in Jesus Christ are immediately placed by the Holy Spirit into one united spiritual body, the Church, because  they not only want to corrupt, influence other Christians it would be unthinkable for them to admit they have false doctrines, and can be rightfully excluded from the true believers in Jesus Christ.

  Dispensational theology breaks Scripture into separate parts (really into separate revelations), each applicable for a limited time and a limited audience. The growth of DISPENSATIONALISM coincided with a break  away church that supported  a supposedly changing, accommodating, developing God.  Dispensationalists denies the contractual  covenant  duties of the people of God. Dispensationalists holds that the complete Old Testament was no longer binding. DISPENSATIONALISM also falsely teach that the teachings of the  the New testament Gospels are not binding to any Christians because they rather pertain to the future. Dispensationalists falsely also say Christ’s death was His alternative  plan “B” after the Jewish people rejected His attempt to establish His earthly Kingdom, and that He will come back and try it again later. Dispensationalists also falsely try to  tells the true church that we are in a parenthesis, a holding period, until Christ returns to set up His Jewish Kingdom and Israel is the center fold of the Bible.. While Jesus himself had said my kingdom is not of this world.. DISPENSATIONALISM  was, and is a false foundation on which the believers in the church can only be led astray from the truth of God, and his word to us.

The three general views of Dispensationalism:

-There is what is called hyper-Dispensationalism. One of their distinctives is the teaching that the Church did not begin until the middle of the Book of Acts.

-There are those who are called classical dispensationalists. C.I. Scofield, Lewis Sperry Chafer and others of the old school would come under this designation. They held that Israel is on earth and the Church is in heaven and the twain shall never meet.

-The neo-dispensationalist view is promoted by such leaders as Charles C. Ryrie, Dwight Pentecost and Zane Hodges. They hold that the Church and Israel shall come together after the millennium. They differ from the old dispensationalists, in that they teach that saints in the Old Testament were saved by faith.

Each of these views has many distinctives and differences from the others, and it is not at all a basic, simple, straightforward, unified belief,  Gospel as the Brethren try too often to mislead others to believe in too.

While the Plymouth Brethren even say they Believe the Bible is the Word they have clearly seem to like to eradicate, explain away the Bible references to personal  judgement, reaping, sins, Hell, damnation, and I often still do wonder why? what are they hiding? are fearful of? the real truth? It is true that there have been many dispensationalists who have not embraced selective-resurrection or chastisement at the judgment seat.

Most Christians  still don’t seem to realize that because of Israel’s disobedience, God is finished with national Israel. Let’s look at what Jesus had to say to the nation of Israel:

 Matthew 21:18-19  Now in the morning, when He returned to the city, He became hungry. 19 And seeing a lone fig tree by the road, He came to it, and found nothing on it except leaves only; and He said^ to it, “No longer shall there ever be any fruit from you.” And at once the fig tree withered.

In reality  The Church Is the full replacement for Israel Now. That   sums up the heart of real, valid theology, that the Christian church is heir of the promises to and the responsibility of the Hebrew nation of old. When God blessed Abraham in Genesis 22:17—18, He promised: “[T]hy seed shall posses the gate of his enemies.” In Matthew 16:18, after Peter confessed faith in Jesus Christ as the Messiah, Christ said, “[U]pon this rock [this profession of faith] I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.” Abraham’s seed was promised the gate of his enemies, and then Christ promised His church they would occupy the gates erected by hell itself. Another aspect of that promise to Abraham was that in Him all nations would be blessed. That blessing is Jesus Christ and His salvation. But who is now commanded to teach and baptize “all nations” in the Great Commission? The church, the people of Jesus Christ, who are heirs of Abraham’s faith.

There is a great disagreement within Christiandom as to who the “Israel of God” is. Does this refer to the nation Israel or to the Church of Jesus Christ? How you answer this question is very important. If you are going to understand the Bible and its promises, you must understand who “Israel” is. What we believe influences how we behave. What Christian leaders teach about the Jews and Arabs influences how Christians view the events unfolding in the Middle East. I also believe that there is a direct connection between the church’s view of Israel and terrorism.  A wrong view of Israel   affects  the  foreign policy negatively  also. Because of the even  false Dispensationalism and the false  Christian Zionism, most American Christians believe that we have a biblical mandate to stand with and protect Israel in spite of any of the unacceptable bad things Israel itself now does too The Dispensationalist, as well as the Zionist, falsely believes that the nation of Israel is still God’s chosen people, the sole inheritors of God’s promises, and that to be a part of Israel, one must be of the proper lineage and nationality.  Zionism is not a Christian Movement but a political movement built on the belief that the Jewish people still do deserve by right to possess all of the land of Palestine . Israel too as their own. Christian Zionism is essentially a Christian prophetic support for Zionism; seeing the modern state of Israel, and the equivalent of the old testament biblical Israel. Christian Identity teaches a similar idea that Israel is actually composed of the descendants of the ten “lost tribes” that became the Anglo-Saxon and Germannic peoples. According to this view, to be a part of “Israel,” one must be of this fleshly lineage.  There is absolutely no new testament reverences, verses of support for any of this This is all unbiblical per the New testament now as well, for, just as with Dispensationalism, the emphasis is placed upon the flesh and temporal, instead of upon the Spirit and the eternal. Put another way, according to these systems of doctrine, the focus is taken from the cross of Jesus Christ, and is instead placed upon the merits of man. And that makes it all false too. http://www.preteristplanet.com/id79.html

There are too many false evangelical religious groups  who try to seduce others by their false MISLEADING STATEMENTS.
 
When someone one says to me, others, on the net that they believe the Bible is the word of God, they believe Jesus is God and He is an equal  part of the Trinity, they believe in the Holy spirit now as being a person as well,  but they next do  deny falsely the existence of the the Holy Spirit’s  spiritual, charismatic gifts, they now are still lying, falsely  playing on words, because you cannot accept Jesus Christ and reject the Holy Spirit and his gifts. The Holy Spirt is the Spirit  of Christ. Thus they really are not Christians, for how could the Holy Spirit now be even guiding them and leading them into all truth when they cannot be led by him into these basics even.. rather they are being led by the devil, others, mere men, and not God undeniably still too.

 The hypocritical  Plymouth brethren falsely want to maintain that they are Christians,  a part of the Body of Christ Universal , when it is also clearly undeniable they are nor only the the dispensationalists. Plymouth brethren  and the   dispensationalists, Plymouth brethren   also falsely do  bash, try to discredit, do abuse the Pentecostal Christians who they falsely  claim now are not even Christian. Not one persons in decade has even rightfully showed me why I am not a Christian even though I am also a Pentecostal one too now.

Dispensationalists who now say that salvation is wholly of God by grace on the basis of the redemption of Jesus Christ, the merit of His shed blood, and not on the basis of human merit or works falsely exclude any future personal; accountably too.

The brethren falsely  would like us to belief that even the en commandments are not applicable to us today, and yet James judges the belief, the applicable faith  of other supposedly Christians by them still too.
 
James 2:5  Hearken, my beloved brethren, Hath not God chosen the poor of this world rich in faith, and heirs of the kingdom which he hath promised to them that love him?
6  But ye have despised the poor. Do not rich men oppress you, and draw you before the judgment seats?
7  Do not they blaspheme that worthy name by the which ye are called?
8  If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself, ye do well:
9  But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors.
10  For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.
11  For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law.
12  So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.
13  For he shall have judgment without mercy, that hath showed no mercy; and mercy rejoiceth against judgment.
14  What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?
15  If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food,
16  And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?
17  Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.
(Mat 19:16 KJV)  And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?
17  And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.
18  He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness,
19  Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
20  The young man saith unto him, All these things have I kept from my youth up: what lack I yet?
21  Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me.
 
Instead of rightfully here too taking Jesus words at face value, like they do with too many things, the Brethren have their own false re explanations, interpretations..
 
(Gal 6:7 KJV)  Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap.
  
(Gal 6:8 KJV)  For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting.
  
(Gal 6:9 KJV)  And let us not be weary in well doing: for in due season we shall reap, if we faint not.
  
(Gal 6:10 KJV)  As we have therefore opportunity, let us do good unto all men, especially unto them who are of the household of faith.

  The rather first Christian dispensationalist we seem to tend to know is the heretic Apostle Judas even one of the 12 original Apostles

(Mat 13:22 KJV)  He also that received seed among the thorns is he that heareth the word; and the care of this world, and the deceitfulness of riches, choke the word, and he becometh unfruitful.

(Mark 4:19 KJV)  And the cares of this world, and the deceitfulness of riches, and the lusts of other things entering in, choke the word, and it becometh unfruitful.

(John 8:23 KJV)  And he said unto them, Ye are from beneath; I am from above: ye are of this world; I am not of this world.

(John 18:36 KJV)  Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.

(1 Cor 1:20 KJV)  Where is the wise? where is the scribe? where is the disputer of this world? hath not God made foolish the wisdom of this world?

(1 Cor 2:6 KJV)  Howbeit we speak wisdom among them that are perfect: yet not the wisdom of this world, nor of the princes of this world, that come to nought:

(1 Cor 3:19 KJV)  For the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God. For it is written, He taketh the wise in their own craftiness.

(1 Cor 7:31 KJV)  And they that use this world, as not abusing it: for the fashion of this world passeth away.

(2 Cor 4:4 KJV)  In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

(Eph 2:2 KJV)  Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:

(Eph 6:12 KJV)  For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

(Rev 11:15 KJV)  And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.

 (Rev 1:5 KJV)  And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood.

(Rev 19:10 KJV)  And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See thou do it not: I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.

(Rev 22:16 KJV)  I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star.

(Rev 22:20 KJV)  He which testifieth these things saith, Surely I come quickly. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus.

(Rev 22:21 KJV)  The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you all. Amen.

 I also came to the conclusion that the King James Bible is the best version available in the English language today for Bible study, easy reference too. The Bible publishing world is presently involved in a high stakes monetary race to come out with, so called, “newer and better” versions of the English Bible. And, what is their motive? There are countless versions of the English Bible on store shelves today. Is the English language changing so fast that we need a newer translation than the one that came out last month or last year? I think not. They seem to like to push  a different doctrine, and have just as many errors next  it seems as they one they had originally claimed to try to correct.  

I also do believe that God inspired the original writings of the Bible, which are called the autographa. There are many verses that teach this. Here are two key verses that I want you to see…
 
The more important Question is, do you and I really believe it is the word of God or are you looking for another Bible  translation to justify some of your immoral acts, and/or wrong beliefs still too?!

2 Peter 1:20-21 “Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation (that is, they did not originate with man). 21 For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.”

2 Timothy 3:16 “All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:”

But, there is also the matter of verbal preservation of the apographa (copies of the originals). I believe that God has preserved His Words in the copies of those original writings in the Hebrew Masoretic Text of the Old Testament and the Traditional Text (Textus Receptus) of the New Testament.

I have FAITH that the God who inspired the original autographs can and did preserve the apographs so that we can say, “Thus saith the Lord; This IS the Word of God” when we hold up our King James Bibles.

https://postedat.wordpress.com/?s=Plymouth++Brethren
https://postedat.wordpress.com/2008/09/19/dispensationalists-it-seems-to-compensate-for-their-often-rejections/
http://witnessed.wordpress.com/2008/09/09/the-false-dispensationalists-dispensationalism/
https://postedat.wordpress.com/2008/08/02/zionism-zionists/

http://mccainvrsobama.wordpress.com/2010/09/23/even-as-to-the-promised-land/

 

The really Bad Alliance , Evangelical churches..

Chrsitian and Missionary Alliance still in the church snatching business

Jesus said we should be gentle as doves and wise as serpents. Christians are doing a horrible job of being wise, at variance with this solemn commandment.

We need to be aware that the emergent church movement is completely out of keeping with biblical principles and is ungodly. This is why we have liberal mega-churches gobbling up small defenseless churches that are still true to the gospel of Jesus. I have warned elsewhere that almost all denominations, including those purporting to be “conservative,” are part of this emergent church movement and are slowly taking over the true church. We are thus returning to the situation in the Europe that we escaped from to avoid persecution — where the State church demanded allegiance to it. We are on our way to a state church here in America. Beware! It will be the end of religious freedom and the beginning of tyranny right here under our noses.

Donald Hank

September 22, 2008

Christian & Missionary Alliance Leader Named in Fraud & Extortion Scheme

District Superintendent Wayne Spriggs Seizes Reedsville Bank Account and Church Property

On the heels of the C&MA Headquarters being sued for stealing $18,000 bank account and $650,000 church property of a Chinese church in Colorado Springs, and more recently a Vietnamese Boat People Church, in Long Beach California, the Eastern Pennsylvania District of the C&MA as now hijacked another church.  This time in Reedsville, Pennsylvania, spearheaded by Wayne Spriggs, District Director, who has a history of threatening people.

The Summary Letter by former C&MA Credentialed Pastor Bob Iddings, Reedsville Christian & MIssionary Alliance Church, Reedsville, Pennsylvania:

“SHOUT IT FROM THE ROOF TOP”

But if the watchman see the sword come, and blow not the trumpet, and the people be not warned; if the sword come, and take any person from among them, he is taken away in his iniquity; but his blood will I require at the watchman’s hand. (Eze 33:6 AV)
 
The Christian and Missionary Alliance has seized another church, its parsonage and its bank account, this time by the hands of Wayne Spriggs, District Superintendent of the Eastern Pennsylvania District of the Christian and Missionary Alliance and its District Executive Committee (DEXCOM). 
 
A disgruntled adherent from our church who was displeased when she did not get her way, called our District Superintendent, Wayne Spriggs, and insisted on a congregational meeting in an attempt to have me removed from the church and “to ruin me”.  Although a congregational meeting was not held, what was to follow was a nightmare for our church adherents and myself.
 
It was a known fact by our District Superintendent that another church in our community who was currently renting space was interested in our church property, which we feel was at the root of what was to ensue, as Wayne Spriggs is attempting to close many of our small churches to acquire money to fund start up of new mega/emergent churches which he believes is the direction our churches should be going.  He is opposed to the small churches and feels that they lack the ability and resources to evangelize.
 
Wayne Spriggs knowing that I am a man who stands for what he believes, forced my hand by demanding certain requirements to be met by myself and my church people or face closure of the church. He knew we would not agree to his terms, thus forcing my resignation.  However, he did not allow us the time we asked for to prepare for closure, but came to our church one Sunday evening with the news the church would be closed, and the next day came and confiscated all financial records and immediately went to the bank and withdrew all the churches funds.  Although the church was slated to close in two weeks, there was never another service held at the church and the church adherents were not notified, only to come to the church the following Sunday to find a sign on the door that there would be no services for the next two weeks. 
 
During this time, Wayne made accusations of misconduct on my part to have DEXCOM issue a decree that I was forbidden to attend prayer conference scheduled during the same week he closed the church.  This was done in an attempt to keep other churches and pastors from knowing what had happened.  During the months that followed, Wayne refused to allow me to attend meetings held by DECOM and LO&CC concerning my situation and when I was asked to meetings with a few of his hand chosen representatives, I was not permitted to bring anyone with me as a witness and I was denied written copies of minutes of those meetings.  In addition, when I was cleared of all charges, Wayne immediately had LO&CC suspend my license for failure to follow through with his demands without following proper procedures set forth by the constitution of the C&MA.  Although I had challenged him on several occasions concerning his mishandling of the proper procedures to be followed, he chose to disregard my concerns and proceeded forward with his erroneous handling of the situation.  I later appealed this to our National Office who found that proper procedures were not followed and asked that he reinstate my license, which he refused to do until I wrote a letter resigning my credentials with the C&MA.                    
 
During this entire ordeal, our family was going through a crisis with our daughter who was facing surgery the day after we were told the church would close for possible iliac cancer.  Wayne showed no compassion for our situation, nor did he or anyone from the district ever inquire about my daughter’s condition or situation.  His only concern was that we be out of the parsonage by May 31st, of which he reminded us on several occasions.  He lacked any concern for the fact that we had no job, no income and limited time to find housing due to our family crisis.
 
The Christian and Missionary Alliance is no longer true to the scriptural principles on which it was founded.  They are embracing the emergent church movement and will not hesitate to enforce their reversionary clauses and liquidate any churches assets or confiscate funds in order to move forward with their new agenda and fund these new churches.  Let this serve as a warning, your church could be next!!!    Robert Iddings, former Christian & Missionary Alliance pastor

This hostile takeover by the C&MA is nothing new, but in fact, follows a well published pattern of devouring their own brothers in Christ.  Here are two recent pending cases:  The C&MA’s seizure of the C&MA Chinese church story entitled: ”Suing for Reconciliation” is available in Christianity Today Magazine [See: http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2008/june/3.16.html]  and the Colorado Springs Gazette: “Congregation Suing District after its Home is Sold”  [see: http://www.gazette.com/articles/congregation_38941___article.html/district_home.html].  Also read the comments on that article.  Here is one of oft recommend posts by Rocksalt [see other posts too]:
“My highest commendation to Gazette Reporter Marc Barna..his story was NO SPIN…very balanced! I wrote three documentaries on the C&MA. The truth about what the C&MA did is even more sinister and evil than the article reflects. The account by the Chinese members is correct. A public relations nightmare for the C&MA either way the court case goes. One clarification re The “Reversion Clause” is that “accredited”, though it makes it much easier to hijack the church then when it is merely “affiliated”, it is not license, due process, and the absence of fraud and arbitrariness must prevail in exercising the reversion clause…even the C&MA Constitution states this. For a complete report on the C&MA’s seizure of the Chinese church and the more recent seizure of another ethnic church and its even larger bank account by the C&MA which was a Vietnamese Boat People church in Long Beach, California, and the investigation of C&MA VIce President John Soper, contact rock.salt@verizon.net

The Vietnamese hostile takeover story will be in an upcoming issue of District Weekly in Long Beach, California.

Full report of Christian & Missionary Alliance denomination hijacking of Reedsville Christian and Missionary Alliance Church is available at:

http://www.purposedrivel.com/2008/09/c-seizing-churchesassets-of-faithful.html

 http://laiglesforum.com/2008/09/23/chrsitian-and-missionary-alliance-still-in-the-church-snatching-business/

http://laiglesforum.com/2008/09/22/the-evangelical-church-becoming-corrupt-culturally-irrelevant/

Note this is the denominational church of Canada’s Prime Minister Stephen Harper,  and if this is what his church now is like, what is he realy like himself?

 Sadly for many years I have had nothing bad bad experience with 4 of the Canadian Christian Missionary Alliance churches, and they had lied to me, abused me.. undeniable facts I have detailed to all the Canadian members of Parliament, and to the major Canadian News editors, and posted it on the net.. this was a church composed mostly of liars, thieves, imposters and pretenders in my witness… it is not real a Real Christian Church for sure.

  Here is what I know for sure in Canada proper policing, management ,  supervision  human rights commissions are a real fact of life, society, in schools, life,  in churches, governments, commerce, institutions, civil and public services, professional services too,  and elsewhere, even on the net,  for you will always have those 30 percent at least of the persons who will try to cheat, lie  , steal, bend the rules, falsely believe they are above the laws, Self  regulation alone is too often pretentious, farcical, often not applied as well. That applies especially to the professionals, civil and public services, police, municipalities, politicians now as well..

 

http://thenonconformer.wordpress.com/2008/09/25/prime-minister-stephen-harper-and-the-federal-conservative-party-of-canada/

http://thenonconformer.wordpress.com/2008/09/25/prime-minister-sets-our-watchdogs-on-the-press/